Thanks for the update and clarification Chris, everyone enjoys a bit of back and forth, especially if it's done in good nature, there will always be things like this pop up when you have a massive mix of people and views, as long as the issues get pointed out and dealt with(like now) then it's all good. You lot get a lot of crap doing what you do, even thrown some myself at times in the past, you all do a good job though man. Fair play.

In regards to the new submission guide update, what if a site has based an entire article off the back of a devoper 1 tweet opinion? This happens a lot where one tweet is turned into a big article full of nothing.

Finally!

Bring back bubbles.....

Bring back the "IGNORE" feature so we can filter out the rabid fanboys that constantly spam the comments in defense of their preferred system.

Thank you, this clarification was needed. I'm all for controversial statements from industry veterans, but some of these up and coming indie developers are truly trolling. This, below, is Dynamic Voltage Games, the developer who sparked Christopher's post here. I mean, it's not HIS fault... he can troll all he wants on Twitter. That is his space, outside of N4G. It was the contributors trying to weaponize it as flamebait over here on N4G, so it needed to be clarified what IS and ISN'T news, as far as developer twitters go. I mean, look at this one...

https://twitter.com/dynamic...

its easy. Start to ban twiiter comments made into «news»...

Question about the social issues and opinion pieces - does this mean that someone who write a piece applying social theory to a particular genre or specific game won’t be allowed? Ex: someone wants to talk about orientalism, empire and CoD. I’d love more in depth commentary on our beloved medium and I think that’s where the real meat is. Outside of general news updates, most of the content that gets approved isn’t even saying anything; it’s lifeless.

Gaming is such a vibrant medium and there’s a lot being talked about, yet all we get here is console war fuel. Wouldn’t it be nice to mix things up with some REAL discussion?

Another ex: There is a submission on the trans narrative in the Last of Us 2 that has been reported already. It will probably fail, but the submission where we learn that Mario is actually Japanese and not Italian will most probably be approved.

One of those is a real topic, with real things to be said about it, but we won’t get that chance. I’m not saying N4G should become a graduate seminar, but the bar on quality content and commentary can surely be raised a bit, no?

I really appreciate your clarification on the subject.

If I'm allowed to provide my opinion, I have noticed from people I know and many users here that the perception of N4G is that while rules are there, many use them as weapons to silent news, opinions or users that support a certain company while promoting those that favor another company that they do prefer. As a result, the whole site is perceived as extremely biased towards one side (PS in this case). This isn't N4G administration fault, as PS is obviously more popular than other systems, but as the new generation heats up and other systems starts to gain popularity, the resistance to this change has been obvious. I've seen a couple of friends of mine being banned for no apparent reason (I think I can provide proof of at least one of them) and they literally told me "you need to be extremely careful there or you're going to be hunted and banned" as well of other users I didn't even know. As you can see in my history, I've been here for almost 15 years, but the new generation and home lock-down due to the global situation brought me back to posting.

As a result, I've been insulted and harassed countless times and I've decided to either ignore those insults or respond without offending. I honestly have a hard skin and not get easily offended, but that's just me. I think it isn't fair that every Xbox fan have to go through this once they start speaking up while I've seen many fans on the other side acting downright as trolls or being extremely mean to other users and getting away with it. I'm 100% sure I would've been banned ages ago if I followed that kind of behavior.

Not playing the victim here though as I foresee some people may think. Just want to send a message about equality in the site as I believe it's the healthiest way to long last in the cyberspace when winds start to change.

I've seen a couple of important sites dying for banning left and right supporters of an specific system. This creates frustration among other users and perfectly balanced guys can succumb to this frustration and also get banned for saying this or that. It's a snowball.

Said this, I will do my best to continue to improve my small contribution to this site. I.e. I've seen recent posts from that Dynamic Voltage Game dev way before they were posted here, even when he seems to support Xbox, I've noticed he's a Super Troll... so I've decided not to bring those here.

Anyway, sorry for the long post. This is mainly aimed to mods and above but also to users in general. I wouldn't like to turn this into a ball of accusations in the replies as it wouldn't help the direction where I understand this post from the site admin is aimed at. Hope we can all help building a healthier, more balanced community.

Just my 5 cents. Hope you take this into consideration.

And here we are pretending that the articles are the problem...we should be able to discuss anything regardless of the content in a strict guided manner...displacing discussions of certain topics or titles should be a beacon of how voices and opinion could unite in the efforts of freedom of speech, and shows maturity to credit or discredit readily available information

They never were, it's the fanboyism that is the problem...Christopher You know this, if you guys are serious about regulating this site you guys darn well know the best way to do so is that a better guideline for the users is way more effective than any guidlines for any submissions....after all it's the users that are submitting these articles in the first place...

it goes without saying that for the most part the first comment on an article are from a very strong biases, dear I say fanboy, and is highly likely a trolling and derailing post that never legitimize any constructive decision regardless if the article is accurate or positive

I commend any efforts to promote fairness and less bias, but c'mon this is a futile effort to mitigate any real change around here....ppl troll any and everything that doesnt aligned with thier preferences and choices... and meager efforts are put in place to stop it

you have to manage this problem form the source(fanboyism) and not the source of the article!!!!!

Good for you man. Although any opinion can “elicit a negative response” if it’s an unpopular opinion. We saw this with the last of us 2. A negative response from a fanatic should not be considered a “troll”. Our opinions should not hinge on the emotions of overly emotional people.

To be clear my favorite game this year is TLOU 2. The difference is I didn’t trash anyone who felt differently. It’s just an example where this was prevalent.

The banning on this site isnt good. A friend of mine's account did get banned for simply putting out an honest opinion that was not offensive nor went out of line at all and that comment was then reported by some guy or group of people that were simply furious at the opinion. And he has had that account for years and believed he was being a proper and appropriate user for all those years. Please do a better job at reviewing reports and don't ban them right away. Dont give people the power to ban just because they are angry and have a difference of opinion. Again there was absolutely nothing in his opinions that were ever offensive. I believe it is reporting a comment as SPAM that is what made the account getting banned right away, when obviously is comment was not a "SPAM". Ive seen many comments that have been getting reported as spams the past couple of months. Im guessing most of those were also just opinions that people were just against and furious over so they were reported as "SPAM".

Get rid of the rating system. All you do is invite a popularity contest on all threads. It pointless and irrelevant.

The mods play into it. My first N4G account was banned for over 3000 days because I posted about the Switch having better load times than the competition because it uses all solid state media. Cartridges are just flat-out better than discs. But then I got trolled by sony fanbois and the mods piled on too.

Then you know what happens? A year later the specs for the Ps5 come out, and the sony fanbois are talking up the SSD like it's sweet, sweet ambrosia.

3040 days left on the ban. Thanks you dicks.

Ban this one too if you want. There are an unlimited number of email and IP addresses for me to use on new accounts. I am unbannable.

I've lurked on N4G longer than most anyone here and it's gotten to the point where I just sit back and watch it all burn. However it's refreshing to know that the site administration is aware of how things are and are trying their best to make improvements where they seem appropriate.

Hey Christopher! Big fan. Thanks for the new Guideline, especially this one "or hold onto facts that we don't understand and often misuse ("custom RDNA 2" in general).
" 😂

Can you guys honestly consider banning Gaming Bolt articles? They offer nothing of value to the community. They use misleading, sensationalist headlines. They intentionally take devs words out of context to make it seem like they're saying something controversial. And they purposely go back and forth to fan the console war flames and get that ad revenue. That isn't journalism.

The New NVIDIA graphics tech demo was deleted again and again because console fanboys didnt want it shown.

Seems like part c will remove 90% of gamingbolt articles. Now theyll just have to post the entire interview, instead of their editorial of said response.

But I'm curious if this applies to what we will classify as a verified dev, however that comes to be in the situation, if they state to verify or contradict other presumed or possibly even verified information.

So say, company A says they have this awesome feature which does something, but in true to fashion, people act all confused, the this dev b comes along and states that said feature exists but really isnt that big of a deal, or just says they're excited for it.

That isnt really news, and it seems this policy is broadly defined on that point, and open to a lot of discretion on the mods part, and is likely to still be abused by those trying to stifle good or bad comments, opinions, or articles like they do now.

Otherwise, from what I understand as the intent of this new policy, I think its long overdue.

Thank you Christopher, very well written.

I think this acknowledgement is a good move: "If you start to use the lame report to try and stifle actual news, and nothing else, it will likely result in restrictions or outright bans."

This is a point I've tried to make a few times. It's important to note that it is not an attack on the moderation team. My complaints are with the community members who actively try to use the rules and their loopholes to push their own agendas and biases (or something else). Except for a handful of questionable exceptions, I know that I can recognize when I am posting a comment that could potentially be "inappropriate." So I have no doubts that the certain subset of users here who constantly use the rules to their "advantage" do so with full knowledge of their nonsense.

Like many others currently active on this site, and some other who have told me why they left, the toxicity and general disruption from some users really hurts this site. That's a shame too. I think the system here is better than other places. You've got moderators who are not just tools used by these "digital marketing" firms and SEOs, and you have quite a few users who bring a lot of good discussions to the table. I watch those quality posters disappear too often, though.

But I get it, you can't stop trolls in a hobbyist forum. I have no problem with overly positive fanboys. I really have no problem with some of the little hit and run trolls either. But that other group? The one's who make me think that their intentions are something much worse, and when called out on their nonsense either have a little meltdown or try to claim that they are only "consumer advocates?" They should be called out and removed.

I commented above about the Twitter posts that seem to be the cause for this clarification. That's just a good example of the inherent problems with the system. Even with limited "approval" power, a group can quite effectively shape what is deemed credible and what is not. If something they disapprove of still gets officially "approved," then they will try to shut down any actual discussion about the topic within the thread itself. Many of their tactics are quite literally taken directly from shilling and sock puppet advertising group's playbooks.

But it's all within the rules and hard to combat. I get that. So again, the message has to go to the community and specifically to those users that your BS isn't wanted or necessary.

Create a fanboy war zone to let those who let rip them self apart on console wars.
Video game is a very dispensable activity that should allow people to release some steam, and not be taken too seriously.

As dumb shooter games exists and are appreciated, same thing should be possible for the comments.

At least it will clear for everyone.

Or build a team to manage submissions with a clear editorial line complying with the rules.
It is difficult in one hand to rely completely on the users for the news submission and in the other and to criticize some choices.

Most are not professional journalists.

"LAME REPORTS ACT TO OPPOSE APPROVALS..."

Good! I've seen some people tag a story as "lame" even if it's real news just because they disagree with it, don't like it, etc. News is news. Bad news is still news. Worst case? Just don't read it, right?

Confused.com

You could start by banning gamingbolt then if you truly believe what you just said. All of their submitted articles fall into what you are actually denouncing.

It's like talking politics and religion, everyone has an opinion. It doesn't always make sense or add up in our minds, but that's because we're not necessarily seeing it from there perspective. There's nothing wrong with having an opinion, defending it, and arguing over it, that's what makes America great and in America that's our right, whether our facts are totally jacked up or not, it's being able to speak freely and being able to freely look like a total idiot in front of our peers as a result and there right to call us out on it. That's America. Let them be Fanboys, let them argue their point because we all have bias, we're all Fanboys of something. A sports team, a religious sect, car brand, whatever. Statistically Toyota is known to be the top brand of automobile when it comes to duribility and quality, but on occasion people get a lemon, ya can't always be perfect. And sometimes a Chevy or Ford you get a really good one that acts like a Toyota, but is rare. But diehard Americans are going to buy cars, that aren't even that American anymore because they're Fanboys, doesn't matter Toyota is more American because they're manufactured in Texas while Chevy outsourced to Canada and Ford to Mexico, last I heard, Dodge is the only one that still manufacture in Hazel Park Michigan. But while Toyota builds durible cars, I don't believe they're the most innovative. I believe that goes to the Germans, personally, every time I get into a VW I'm amazed at all the bells and whistles they cram into those, which probably makes them a horrible car to have to work on. Everyone has an opinion and that's alright, opinions turn into arguments, that's how it goes but in the end, when you pull those two people out of the heat of the moment, they shake hands and are buddies. Microsoft and Sony work that way, it's business. It's fierce when they're in the ring, but pull them out of that and they're dining out at a restaurant and shaking hands, having a drink together and laughing and talking about hinting fishing, they're not even talking about business or tech.

So, while all of this is okay and it's healthy, what ISNT okay is threats. We've established it's fine to disagree and argue over it, that's our right, but it's never okay to threaten someone or cause fear that because they don't see it your way that something could happen to them or they could be discriminated, plain and simple. You have the right to be that kind of a person, but that doesn't mean it's okay or tolerated and you will get banned or even charged for that because um.... That's illegal, sir.

Let people state their opinion, let them look like idiots in front of people, I've done it, Joe Biden does it, even Trump does it, and the American people call them out on it, even if their facts aren't fact. But don't let them threaten each other. At the end of the day when the argument is over and the dust settles, we have a common interest, we love games, we love technology, and we we're gamers. It's that simple, we're the same but it's our right to speak out and should be permitted as long as it doesn't go to far (threats) because it's also entertainment for us, as the community to watch others act like idiots, it's entertaining.

I have actually been visiting N4G a lot less these days, due to the clearly biased "filtering" going on with incoming news/rumors/opinions. A lot of the best stuff to read ends up in the failed submissions bin, and fails several times over until it's too old.

I actually see rumors fail *because* they are rumors, and are properly tagged as such!

Lame. Book burning was something I thought we all realized was a bad idea. Apparently some folks think it's "okay, when it fits the agenda". It never is -- the whole idea gets up-ended the moment it fits someone *else's* agenda, I guarantee

Keeps your eyes, and minds, wide open, folks, or society will absolutely suffer the consequences.

We need the ability to block people. Let's be honest, 92% of this website are better off not seeing each other.

"a generic tweet or single response interview item from an industry professional may not be relevant if it provides no new information, is an opinion and not news on hardware, or is a generic response without any specifications as to how something may or may not be handled"

Thank god Christopher. Best rules update since 2015 at the very least.

lol I've seen some extremely stupid reports so glad to see this posted.

Ive been one of those people speaking out lately but let me be clear...I am far from the only one who feels that a lot of suspect situations have been appearing lately. I understand that while this site leans towards Sony and PlayStation by its sheer member counts, that it should be a place gamers regardless of preference can come to, to talk about gaming NEWS! It is called News 4 gamers after all isn't it? My problem with this site is what you allow that isn't exactly conducive to a healthy environment, nor even considered NEWS.

The first thing you do thats suspect as a site is allow "opinion pieces". In the past, this has ranged everything from why one console is better than another, to why one console is going to outsell another etc...lots of time resulting in gamers needing to defend positions. Thats what I'm talking about...you guys put these articles front and center and then act surprised when you breed a bunch of gamers that do nothing but debate positions. I'm not going to suggest that all opinion articles be removed from the site...but why are they on the main page and given such prominence??? They should be off to the side on its own page regardless of which platform it represents. It also shouldn't be a thing that the site looks to promote. As an Xbox fan, I say that with there being a Halo Infinite article on the front page under "hottest stories". Opinion pieces should NOT be valued as much as this site values them. Put them on their own page in one lump and keep them off the main page which should only contain actual news articles about whats actually happing in the world of gaming.

This brings me to my next point. The "heat ratings". Why does this exist??? What is the point of it??? And what determines how much heat an article gets??? Is it YOU that runs the site, or is it based off of WE and how many comments and activity happing in the threads? Are there sort of multiplers added based off topic, key words etc??? Rarely is the most discussed article of the moment ever atop the pile. This is another area where clear bias is shown. I'm going to keep it 100...often times its the PS articles that move right pass the Xbox centric articles to the front of the line so to speak...even when those PS centric articles has less traffic in them. Ive personally witnessed Xbox centric articles with over 100 comments in a couple hours and much activity stay on the second page of the top stories while a new PS centric article moved right past it to the the front of the line with much less comments and traffic. How does that happen??? Why does that happen??? No one knows. Sure some say its how many times we click the article that determines that heat, but come on man...you telling me clicks dont happen when comments and activity are happening in these articles. It doesnt add up, but adds to the fanboy nature of the threads.

The problems that I have seen lately on here are:

1. Crazy fanboys that never want to see reason when they defend their favorite console.

2. Clickbait articles on here that continue to add fuel to the fire.

3. Articles posted on here that tells the reader that if you don't agree with the opinion, then you must be a bad person.

"some things that I think have been progressing unhealthily"

welcome to the entirety of n4g since it's beginnings.

Just my 2 cents, but failing articles after the event shows that the submission process doesn't work.

https://n4g.com/news/236036...

This is a benign article, where people are just discussing games. However, if I or most non-mod users would have tried to fail it for the same reason during the approval process, I'm certain it would have been overturned and ended up being approved anyway.

Then once approved a mod steps in and says no.

There have been a slew of xbox articles that haven't been approved because of favoritism. It hasn't been addressed for a while now. Whether you like it or not, as you pointed out, news is news.

What we need is actually more and better moderators!!

There are a lot of flamebait articles on here that serve no other purpose than to get clicks by posting contrary and crazy opinions.

Bring back the Open Zone just in time for the new consoles.

I just can't see them going back to making their games exclusive again, Forza has sold 5+ million on playstation, that's games actually sold, not game pass that's a number they won't just ignore

Asha is officially the 🐐 Xbox Boss

Sounds like a death rattle to me.

Just GTFO, and take that fake ass CEO Asha with you. Put her back in her previous job which was AI. I will never acknowledge her as the Xbox CEO.

Orchy probably needs therapy he's been all about exclusive games then he was all about how great it is that xbox is everywhere and now he has to go back to being all about exclusivity again

1) So Asha and Matt’s statement says “Along the way, we will reevaluate our approach to exclusivity, windowing, and AI, and share more as we learn and decide.” Interesting. The ‘approach’ word hints at Microsoft not being all exclusive or all third party, it may be launch exclusively on Xbox, as Forza 5 was still a hit on PS5 despite a delayed release.

2) Asha kills off ‘This is an Xbox’ and introduces ’WE are an Xbox!’
This will go down great with all the people who have a parasocial relationship with the brand like Parris Lilly and Colt Eastwood!

3) “At our best we:
Earn every player
Protect our art
Stay rebellious
Progress over perfection
Signal over ceremony
Core before more
Outwork the problem
Speed is learning
Makers over managers
Clarity is kindness”

Not gonna lie, that list is pure corporate speak (although the first two do mean something)

This is what they Hyde behind all those words

Stabilize Gen9 as a healthy and high-quality base
(Our ship is sinking and need help)
Fix the fundamentals for players and partners
(Our investors need money MONEEEY)
Maintain and grow in live games and long-term stewardship
(Give us more money)

It’s my sexbox, and her name is Sony

They’re trying anything to remain relevant going into the next gen. We’ll see how this turns out for them.

best of luck to spice up the industry

My left nut is an Xbox

Idk they've definitely been acting like they don't exactly know what they are with all these odd, numerous and drastic changes they've been doing this gen lol.