... just because people here are to thick and too brainwashed by the industry to understand it, and thus automatically hit the 'disagree-button', doesn't make it any less logical.

You'll now have people buying a console and overpriced controllers, who otherwise wouldn't have considered buying the system.

And now, believe it or not, when you have a group of a million extra customers who otherwise wouldn't even have had your system, a part of that group will NOT just download EVERYTHING. There is always still a part of that group that will be willing to spend money on certain games!

Not just that. This kinda 'piracy' can turn non-gamers in todays generation, into PAYING gamers in the next generation. Just like many of us who are now paying for our 360 and PS3 games, became gamers because of falling in love with this hobby through our copied games on the Amiga and C64! (Yeah, I'm old...)

Don't forget, MANY parents refuse to buy their children a console, cause the games are too expensive. Once it becomes an option to download the games for free, there are parents who are then OK with it.
Those kids who otherwise wouldn't have been gaming, now have a new hobby.

They aren't paying for it, so in the short-term it won't benefit the industry....

...but in 5 to 10 years those kids will be older, have their own money, there will be new consoles out, and many of them will have turned into consumers!

Ofcourse, many people here will just read the first 3 sentences of my post and just hit the disagree-button, cause that's how it works here, but I really wish people would stop looking at this subject so incredibly close-minded and short-term...

It's NOT a black/white, right/wrong issue. Piracy DOES have benefits. In fact, many of todays consumers and developers got into this industry because they were able to sample it, and discover a love for it, through copies and downloads, many years ago!

Couldnt agree more Ryudo. I know people who pirate games, do i concider myself better than them? Nope because my game collection from this gen is like 70% second hand games. And if you count all games ive ever owned its more like 90%.

@Kran: Are you trying to tell me smoking pot is bad?!

But seriously, it will increase console sales, there's a lot of people who were waiting for this, but it also may harm software sales from which Sony gets quite a number of money also with current attach rate which will fall cause of piracy.
It's is bad for Sony's profit, and the whole console war BS is fanboy's dream.

@Ryudo: Statistically your percentage isn't accurate. I haven't count 100 people of the type here and while I'm quite anti-piracy on PS3 I don't fit your description.

@Yi-Long

Finally someone sensible in here, A downloaded game doesn't always = a lost sale.

Am going to do what many of you are to pig head or afraid to do here and admit I do pirate certain games.

I pirate DS games, I would never in my life spend 30 pound on a half baked handheld experience, when I have my PS3 my PC and my Wii which I could spend that money on.

I buy all the Nintendo hardware, I have a DS lite and a DSI XL. I would of never of bought either systems without the option to download my games. And why that does mean Nintendo makes very little money from me is that truly better then no money at all?

And sure you could go well the developers are getting nothing, and honestly am sorry about that. But they wouldn't be getting any of my money regardless I don't spend £30 pound on a handheld game never have never will.

On the other hand my PS3 is totally legit, and so is my Wii, I have never pirated a game for either. Because I believe I do get my moneys worth when I buy games for either of them systems.

I also don't pirate games on my PC, simply because I can't. Am not interested in single player PC games, I only play MultiPlayer/MMO's as such to go online I need the original anyway so I buy tons of games for my PC.

Piracy is not black and white as said above, developers make plenty of money from me. There are people out there who don't pirate anything hurting the game industry way more with used game sales.

And you can go ahead and disagree and shout at me all you want at least am being honest unlike most of you guys.

"Once it becomes an option to download the games for free, there are parents who are then OK with it. "

Eh? Those're some funky parents.

Although it is true that piracy can often lead to sales (for example, a bunch of people heard about Minecraft, pirated it, liked it, bought it.) but the piracy in this case is due to the system being blown wide open, which is the bigger problem since it leads to game files being modified.

PC-games usually are developped with the foresight that people will attempt to hack it, and counter-measures are there. (Remote rcon tools, anti-cheat systems, etc). Console games are not made with this in mind.

So what'll eventually happen is that the online experience will get fudged. Which will just result in people going elsewhere. It's why many people left the PC for consoles.

So if the ps3 was just modified to play pirated games, then things might be different... but right now, it can be exploited to do a lot more damage than simply play a game you downloaded.

... and if playing pirated games was the only way for some people, then a PC would be a better option anyways. Otherwise, it's not like they won't buy games later on in life if they were denied games at a young age.

... you REALLY think this will affect SONY's profits!?

It won't. Just think about it. A PS3 controller here in Holland costs 60 euro(!) Now, let's be conservative and say Sony makes a 25 euro profit on every controller sold (cause in other parts of the world they sell for less than 30 euro, and I doubt they're selling them at a loss over there...)

So let's say we've got an extra million customers who are now buying a PS3 because it can be jailbroken. You're average PS3-system comes with 1 controller, and most families would want 2, right!? So they'll buy an extra controller.

Just on controllers alone, that's a 25 million dollar profit right there. And that's on 1 extra controller! If these families exist of your average kids, they'll probably have to buy a new controller every year orso...

... you can do the math.

Now, what do you think they make on a sold 3rd party game, IF it's even sold at full-price, and how many games does the average console-consumer even buy!? (average attach rate...)

I'm pretty damn sure that their 'profit' from one 3rd party game sold (full-price) is less than 5 bucks.

So no, I doubt Sony will feel a loss. It's the publishers and developers who could worry, but TBH not more than they do normally, considering 2nd hand sales, or bad reviews, or stiff competition.

It's very simple. If you make a good/great game and don't screw up the marketing, you will sell lots of games. Piracy or no piracy.

PS3 will takeover 360, no way around it

@Yi-Long: According to latest estimations provided in recent articles Sony makes probably around 8eur( src: http://www.battlestrats.com... ) based on usd-eur course and in average on royalties ALONE for each your everyday disc-based new game. Let's focus on this one only.
With attach rate around 8( http://www.psuni.com/ps3-so... ) it makes about 64eur for each new customer.
Let's say theres half of million of new customers without piracy which gives around 32m on ROYALTIES ALONE which they don't earn cause of piracy.
Add to that games they publish, games from their own studios and the number is much bigger. And they still sell the controllers.

... first of all.... Sony won't sell those controllers to people who don't have the console, thus not making that huge profit.

2nd of all, the attach-rate is 8 games per console, but obviously most people don't buy all those games at full price.

Personally, I think the last game I bought near full-price was LBP. All the others I just waited for a sale. This means Sony also makes less from those royalties.

3rd of all, the attach-rate for a console covers the lifespan of that console. The (very conservative)calculation I made was over 1 year, and just for 1 controller per year...

I seriously doubt this whole thing will affect sales much, or even 1st party sales. We'll see how Uncharted 3 will do when it comes out this year, but I predict it will still sell more than Uncharted 2.

Why? Because if something is worth the money, then most people are willing to spend money on it, even if they could get it for free.

@FatOldMan; I completely agree with your concern about you concern over how this will affect the in-game experiences of many online games. The modding and cheating could (and probably) will ruin a lot of people's experiences online, unless they can find a way around it with special lobbies and such... which will probably be pretty difficult...

So yeah, absolutely that's a good point and solid concern.

@Ryudo: I'm kinda the same.

My 360 and PS3 are totally legit, cause they're worth it, and the handhelds which I only bought for the occasional trip on a train or plane, were only bought because it allowed me to play downloaded games on them. Otherwise I never would have bought them cause it wouldn't have been worth the money for me, as I rarely play on them.

My girlfriend also has a modded Wii. She isn't a gamer and rarely ever plays on it, but it's still a nice toy for her. She bought the system (actually she received it as a present from her folks) cause it could be modded so they could enjoy it when small nieces and such would come to visit.

However, she has spend money on nunchucks, controllers, a dancemat, a drum (Taiko Big Drum), and a DJ hero set. Also, there are some games on it that I like, and if they'd hit XBLA, I'd happily spend 1200 points on them (Madworld, Muramasa...).

Plus, if there's finally a Wii2 HD coming with Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 in HD, I'd certainly spend money on that as well.

So it means we might spend very little money on Nintendo right now, but some of them are so good that we're more than willing to spend money on them once they hit a system we prefer (A HD-Wii, XBLA/PSN, whatever...)

regarding piracy on the PS1 there is no way of knowing how many PSONE's were pirated, and even if there was i doubt the large percentage of 100 million PSONE owners pirated, the reality is as far as consoles go piracy is pretty minor in comparison to the pc , this whole PS3 hack has been WIDLEY overblown imo

More people buying a Ps3 will boost console sales, but game sales will suffer just like the Psp!

Ultimately, this will hurt the Playstation brand as a whole!

If you can upgrade to a 1 TB HDD... why would you ever need to buy a game, especially if you can get it free? Remember, a lot of the Ps3 owners like the idea of free. Free online is why most bought it.

Sony needs to do something about this soon!

Its Microsoft & Nintendo

who should be the ones taking measures to restrain these hackers to court because once pirated games on the PS3 hits the black market, it will send PS3 sales to sky rocket past the 360 & Wii all the way to Number one again like the PS2.

I am very sure for four freaking years now, a lot of budget gamers are itching to have their claws playing a Dual Shock 3 instead of a 360 controller or a Wiimote.

That's for sure!