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480°

Pachter: Kinect is a "limited device"

Gamerzines writes:

In reflecting upon last week's E3 event, industry analyst Michael Pachter has cast his opinion regarding Kinect, Microsoft's venture into hands-free motion control for the Xbox 360.

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gamerzines.com
SupaGamer5806d ago

Again he states the obvious.

kingdavid5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

If anything its gonna work in natals favour now that this guy's put the jinx on it.

Hes got the complete opposite of a midas touch.

jjacinto235806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

did he just contradicted all the things he said about Kinect wow

HolyOrangeCows5806d ago

Maybe Pachter should state the obvious for a living.

pixelsword5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

@ HolyOrangeCows:

He does, but even he finds a way to bungle it up when the does what he's not good at... like "thinking".

Redgehammer5806d ago

you serious? Now Mr. P. speaks the obvious, and I thought the general consensus was that he was almost always wrong.

Baka-akaB5806d ago

nope the consensus always was that he's either completely wrong , or make very safe bets by stating the obvious

jack_burt0n5806d ago

Pachter 2 weeks ago on gametrailers bogus round:

"When you see the massive ammount of titles coming for natal you will be blown away they are going to dominate E3 and the holiday season."

ummmmmm no.

Mista T5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

I have to agree with him, there are many genres not possible Kinect, like FPS for example that isn't on rails. even though its quite obvious that its limited because of the lack of buttons

EDIT: please, lets have an enlightening discussion, who disagreed with me and SupaGamer, obviously you don't have a pair to say why you disagreed

NecrumSlavery5806d ago

When I first saw NATAL, I thought of being able to physical throw grenades, push codes on a computer, open door, pick things up, etc in addition to using the controller. Like using the touch screen on a DS but still have buttons for controlling. Like many mini games. Chinatown Ward on DS showed the game works great with touch screen minigame features throughout. With NATAL, you could physically play poker in Red Dead. Or hot wire cars in GTA4. Maybe toss grenades in Gears, or pick flowers in Fable. Using Kinect like that would be great. Also letting your avatar in guitar hero mimic your body for sweet powerslides. Maybe add music video creation with the camera. I think all these things are great innovating ideas. And all they showed was an eyepet clone and a bunch of kiddy games. I still have faith that if they can prove Kinect works, it can be used in hardcore games. As an added feature of course. But I don't think MS is targeting us. This time, they are after our moms and little sisters.

Redgehammer5806d ago

but I have a boundless imagination and am not constrained by the belief that kinect's potential should be based on what is possible today, but rather by what could exist in the future. All I have to do is look at the history of my beloved video games to see how far we have come since PONG (I wonder what Mr Alcorn thinks of the evolution). If this is the 7th gen, then motion controls really did not exist, especially in an accessible incarnation, for 6 of those gens. Maybe Pachter is correct in his presumption that Kinects potential is limited; however, I think its several years to early to pass that kind of judgement.

..and for those of you that didn't read the article he said limited, he didn't say bad or any of its synonyms.

IdleLeeSiuLung5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

I completely agree and people don't seem to see that. People only see it as a limitation to what they can do to current experiences.

This is about the future and what experiences will be available, not what it is limited by.

In addition, Kinect is about immersion and not about how easier it is to do with a button. In fact, if that was the case you could beat a game by just pushing a button. Is that fun?

Remember the old NES controllers that had 2 buttons and only a digital pad? Could you imagine what we have today?

boodybandit5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

Of course people see it's limitations because for guys like me that follow technology closely know that Kinect is going to be extremely limited to what it can do. Just from a price point it tells you it wont be able to do no where near the level of what MS will market it to be capable of. I mean they wont flat out lie but they will deceive. They proved that at E3.

Gaming developers still use multiple cameras (displayed at different angles) and actors (or stunt people) in black spandex suits to do motion capturing. The only difference is now the little white balls are gone. They even showed that in the making of Star Wars Force Unleashed 2 that premiered at E3. Those motion capture cameras cost 10s of thousands of dollars. Do you really think MS created a device that will retail between $100 to $150 dollars that is more advanced than what Lucas Arts is using to motion capturing one person to a video game?

They take that video and break it down from torso, head, limbs, feet and hands to eyes, mouth, facial, finger, etc and so on animations. This is common sense speak here and not a fanboy talking. How does anyone that isn't delusional think Kinect will be capable of anything but very casual games and an add on for hardcore with a controller?

I read earlier where a N4G member said that kind of defeats the purpose of Kinect (using it as an add on for hardcore) in the first place. It would be like buying a PSP to use as a side mirror for GT5.

It's not people not opening their minds to the possibilities but more of the technology at that price point can only do so much.

ARBitrator5806d ago

Depending on whose talking, Move is just as limited. For example if you watched the EA Active demonstration during E3, did anyone notice all of the sensors that the people using the PS3 and Wii version had to wear. They had on Leg Sensors, Arm Sensors and Heart Monitors, while the Kinect version only used a heart monitor.

Also, as people say Kinect is limited, can you kick a ball using a move wand. Is Move capable of doing what Kinect does in the dance central demo.

I don't know, just seems to me that people are hating on Kinect (PS3 People that is) because they are worried that it will be more fun than Move.

Any one playing a FPS using move will probably be getting their asses handed to them. It's doesn't matter if it can be used in "hardcore" games if it's not competively effective.

badz1495806d ago

we WAIT? funny, I thought 360 fanboys said waiting sucks! kinda reminds me of "wait till E3" and then BAAMM....Skittles!

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 5806d ago
kiddster585806d ago

I thought that I would chime in on this discussion. While I understand that Kinect is very advanced I think the main reason that it is limiting is what I call Stickman gameplay.It is not able to tell what your hands or feet are doing and recognize them as just the end of your arm of leg like a stub. It will only be good for broad general moves and not persice ones that use the feet or hands. This is the reason for the rail racer(A genre that should never exist) they showed at E3. Even that star wars game that shown was on rails and that was just unacceptable. The only rail games that a even a little fun are rail shooters and Kinect cant even do those because it cant tell what you are doing with your hand. Also to not sound loke a fand boy I will say one thing that would make Kinect better and that would be to use it in conjunction with a controller but microsoft will never do that because that would go against their major argument against move that they don't need buttons. Yes you do.

niceguywii605806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

Header slightly out of context.

EDIT
" please, lets have an enlightening discussion"

LOL a trolling PS3 fanboy wants to talk with his mind is already made up lol.

You don't know what is coming for Kinect, is that enough "discussion" for you?

Why talk? You've been trolling every Kinect article you can find saying the same sh*t.

There are a sh*tload of devs making games by the end of the year this myth will seem silly.
http://g4tv.com/thefeed/blo...

fear885806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

Have you even played it yet?

I can have an opinion on both because I actually did play both. And both suck. Kinect is nothing more than a marketing gimmick to attract uneducated buyers. Which by your comment microsoft seems to have succeeded.

Kinect has little to no appeal to core gamers and its only accurate enough to be used successfully with party games and fitness games. The eyetoy was the same way on the PS2. It just was not accurate enough. And after playing the Kinect demos at E3 I really did come away with the exact thought "I played these games 6 years ago in standard definition"

The move has its own set of problems that it is really steep in price. Its okay as a device, its probably the most accurate out of all of them and can be used with every game you can think of but there really needs to be that DEFINITIVE game that exemplifies why its a good purchase. Core gamers would be sold more on it if there were was extra content available with only the move.

That being said I think that the company that can market the best will win. And if I am correct in this I think Microsoft is going to win in the end. Not because its a better device, its literally crap in quality, but because they will market it to the point where you just cannot ignore it. And if idiots see enough ads they will end up wanting it.

Bigpappy5806d ago (Edited 5806d ago )

Reading your post sounds quit PS fanboyish to me. Whether you played both or not is irrelavent. You are not the only one to play with connect (assuming you are telling the truth about that), there are many article posted by the gaming media from all over the world. I have never read one of them that have said any of what you said in that fanboy rant. You said "I played these games 6 years ago in standard definition". Which game are they? I would like to see the comparison. Just may be you have some proof to your claim, and you can show that you are the only one telling the truth when it comes to Natal.

I await your factual response. Tick, tick, tick. ...

LtSkittles5806d ago

"You don't know what is coming for Kinect, is that enough "discussion" for you?"

And neither do you enlighten me, oh great one who has been to the future.

"LOL a trolling PS3 fanboy wants to talk with his mind is already made up lol."

That's funny coming from you. How many Sony articles have you trolled?

http://n4g.com/news/549088/...

http://n4g.com/news/548535/...

The real killer5806d ago

He got a friend calls..............Hallmark :)

The real killer5806d ago

There is more....................our biggest fanboy Hoops of oops!! ;)

badz1495806d ago

don't even bother, he doesn't have any bubble left to counter! although PM would work but that just doesn't make trolling so special!

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 5806d ago
cronaldo75806d ago

Well done Einstein, I'm sure nobody's thought of that before.

Lord Gunchrote5806d ago

all motion controls are limited...dualshock or 360 controller anyone?

Show all comments (58)
70°

Microsoft Gaming Revenue Drops 7% Year-on-Year, Content and Services Down 5%, Xbox Hardware Down 33%

Microsoft announced its financial results for Q3 of fiscal year 2026, including an update on its gaming Xbox business and more.

Read Full Story >>
simulationdaily.com
Jin_Sakai15d ago (Edited 15d ago )

Not looking good. Hopefully Asha Sharma is able to turn Phil’s disaster around.

dveio14d ago

To me it's still quite remarkable how they can cash-in 5.3bn in revenue in a single quarter, since their hardware is basically dead.

Jingsing14d ago

The stock mark is what makes Microsoft remarkable, They have convinced every institutional and retail investor to just keep piling money into them. Like many big tech giants they are just a big growing pyramid scheme. As long as people keep dropping money into ETF's that cover the market Microsoft will always be liquid. At the same time it is completely stifling innovation and competition. People need to start being more discreet in how they invest their money as it's killing the system.

Tanktopmaster9214d ago

Once they re-evaluate exclusive all will be fine….

S2Killinit14d ago

Riiiiight because people will just flock back to them for one or two games per year.

Jingsing14d ago

15+ years of bad performance is what they call irreparable in business. It is time for them to sell off the assets and get out of entertainment.

Tanktopmaster9214d ago

These declines are on the back of extra revenue received from releasing games like Forza horizon 5 on PlayStation. So I’m being sarcastic here when I said they should go back to exclusives. Killing off a revenue stream from Ps5 sales will only make things worse

Show all comments (13)
70°

Xbox boss: Memory crisis could impact next-gen hardware pricing

Xbox boss Asha Sharma has discussed how component shortages will impact the company's plans for Project Helix.

Read Full Story >>
gamedeveloper.com
Eonjay16d ago

When does this end? Its killing everyone. Consoles and PC. And for what? AI? The benefits of AI are completely outweighed by the negatives. And the government should have never allowed one company to buy up all the RAM.

Lexreborn217d ago

This kind of proves this is an after thought product, most products like this are in r&d 5 years before they start mass producing. So they typically have the cost of components and things worked out long before assembly starts.

This is an assumption still, but I wouldn’t be surprised if project helix is similar to Scalebound,perfect dark and sod3. They had an idea but no actual execution other than concept stage. Being impacted by the ram shortage likely would also put this device 3-4 years out.

I’m not even sure MS has that endurance with Xbox yet

Fishy Fingers17d ago (Edited 17d ago )

I mean.... what?

We're at a point that Samsung wont even provide their own phone department ram because they can sell it at higher prices to 3rd parties (AI). Its more profitable to sell the ram than make their own devices with it.

You think because R&D starts 5 years ago the 3rd party component manufacturers will honour that price? They'll sell it to whomever is paying the most today, not some gentlemens agreement they made years ago. AI farms will buy more volume at higher prices than any console manufacturer will. It'll be the same for Playstation.

Lexreborn216d ago

Contractual agreements are not the same as “gentlemen” agreements. If you think that they work with their distributors a month before production then their entire business model is trash. They work with companies like nvidia constantly for building the graphics cards they need. They work with companies that build motherboards years in advance. This is what proper business planning does.

They are not buying components on a whim like a consumer. So again, considering the ram isn’t a singular module and is integrated into the motherboard I highly doubt they wouldn’t have a final schematic that they are supposed to be building around.

If they are delaying production another 3 years then it’s obvious again this is an after though project and is just trying to be responsive to their bad execution they had the last 14 years.

It also isn’t far fetched to use their failure to produce first party titles the last 7 years including the highly anticipated games I mentioned all being cancelled. That they would continue to you know… lie

Sitdown17d ago

You don't really know how this works huh?

Profchaos17d ago (Edited 17d ago )

Helix is going to be stupidly expensive

Instead of leaning into smarter upscaling techniques they're brute forcing hardware that will cost them dearly and it remains to be seen if it's genuinely going to provide a meaningful differential

I know in the oc.doace people like to brag about not using frame gen or dlss to get to high on a game but for the majority of players they happily use those technologies without a second thought

That's going to be ps6 vs Helix

Eonjay16d ago

Yeah with FSR 5 they should be able to offer a much cheaper version of Helix.

Eonjay16d ago

While this does seem to be the case, I am encouraged by the statement from Microsoft about wanting to provide affordable options. If this means a Series S style Helix, at least there will be something affordable being offered.

XBManiac16d ago

Series S is what has killed Xbox Series so... Will they dare?

blacktiger17d ago

It's called systematic inflationary. Yes we get it Microsoft, keep raising in the name ofall kinds of stuffs

pwnmaster300017d ago

Honestly if there was thing I learned from this generation is that new consoles arnt day one anymore.
I can wait 1-3 years.

DarXyde17d ago

Another important lesson from this generation: while Nintendo showed us that prices don't necessarily need to ever drop, we've now learned that waiting 1-3 years does carry some risk that prices increase. This generation is just bizarre in all the wrong ways.

LucasRuinedChildhood17d ago (Edited 17d ago )

The factors are largely external. Covid and Russia-Ukraine war causing inflation led to the first price increase in 2022.

Then we get Trump's tariffs increasing hardware prices, AI boom causing a RAM crisis, war on Iran causing a worldwide fuel crisis which impacts the cost of everything.

Gaming doesn't exist in a vacuum. The last few years have been a shitshow and lot of it was definitely avoidable.

DarXyde16d ago

LucasRuinedChildhood,

For sure. No disagreement on the external factors doing a lot of this. Where I have to gently push back however is on two fronts:

1. The pandemic definitely caused some issues: asynchronous development was a big issue and really complicated timelines and affected game quality. At the same time, when it comes to price hikes, it's really difficult to know what was genuine necessity and what was taking consumers for a ride. The pandemic brought about "stag-flation" which was increasing prices and stagnant wages, which was a problem caused by supply chain constraints. There was also "Greed-flation", where companies that were slightly affected or had no issues took advantage of the situation and squeezed everyone citing supply chain issues when there were none.

2. It's definitely true that the tariffs, AI boom, and RAM crisis were all things enabled by tech broligarchs throwing money at this caricature of a world leader, one of them being Satya Nadella. I don't think Sony and Nintendo have contributed much to this problem if at all, but Microsoft's Nadella I feel was instrumental in causing every one of those issues. Microsoft as a company contributed to both candidates (though they gave Harris 4x as much if I recall), but Nadella was all in on letting AI run wild. He paid for unregulated AI, and got a war that's not a war (even though Trump called it that at least five times on television) that screwed up helium access. So for me, I feel that one of the players in the gaming industry is a key architect of these issues, and for that reason I struggle a bit to think of it as "external".

Show all comments (28)
50°

'The big things that we're thinking about'

In an exclusive interview with Game File, new(ish) Xbox boss Asha Sharma and Xbox chief content officer Matt Booty explain their vision for Microsoft’s gaming division

Read Full Story >>
gamefile.news
Agent7518d ago

A good start would be to release games to go with the console. My Xbox Series X has gathered dust virtually from launch. My advice would be to ditch a next console and release games on PC, PlayStation and Switch. Another idea would be a hybrid console based on Xbox Series X tech and go the same route as Nintendo. Another idea would be to pull out of gaming altogether. Plenty of options there.

Reaper22_15d ago

Why would they pull out? They have the momentum. Sony has been getting nothing but bad news lately.