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DF: Face-Off: Ninja Gaiden 2 vs. Sigma 2

Digital Foundry contributor MazingerDUDE compare Ninja Gaiden 2 vs Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2:

"How do you turn a game design and engine specifically designed for the architectural strengths of one console, and make it work on a competing platform with an entirely different range of technological plus and minus points? Maybe Tecmo has the answer with Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2."

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eurogamer.net
andron6065d ago

It shows the strong and weak points for both versions of this great game.

Teqmo did a great job of porting it thankfully...

Ravage276065d ago

Very informative and well-explained,particularly the part about the advantages of the PS3 RSX specialized pixel shaders(more operations per clock) versus the flexibility of the 360 unified shader set up.

Essentially while have unified shaders is generally a good thing, there is a trade off. The trade off is that each pipeline isn't as good as a dedicated pipeline. So what you gain in flexibility you lose in outright ability on specific tasks.

That's definitely how GG managed to achieve those spectacular lighting in Killzone 2 :)

Max Power6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

they didn't port the game, the remade it, that is how they got around the exclusivity deal that was in place with Microsoft. Plus they already had the sigma engine from the first one.

IdleLeeSiuLung6064d ago

Yeah, the Sigma engine was completely new and re-worked to match the next generation. The Xbox 360 version is built on top of the aging original Ninja Gaiden engine.

I thinnk any NG fan as stated in this great article points out, get both versions! Playing through it I noticed that there were content outright cut out of the PS3 version. There are also changes to the game mechanic and bosses causing the game to be played slightly different. The blood in the 360 version also gives you a somewhat more satisfying feeling to lop those limbs off!!!

If you are a fan, get both!!!

MNicholas6064d ago

Perfect reflection of the theoretical strengths of each GPU in isolation.

The writer was astute enough to explain the advantages and disadvantages of unified shaders and to outline the benefit of having discrete pixel shader processors.

I hope seeing this information in an article helps fanboys on both sides of the spectrum see things more clearly.

6064d ago
Redempteur6064d ago

Finally someone who know what he is talking about ...

backed by screen and videos to prove his statement ..
N4G need more articles like this one ..instead off "xxx thinks that xxx is going to fail in the next xxx months "

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 6064d ago
callahan096065d ago

"The original 360 code doesn't hold back in the amount of cut-off limbs that pile up, while on PS3 those same appendages disappear almost instantly. Left-behind blood stains on the scenery are also noticeably pared down."

I played both games simultaneously, meaning I played through a room and then switched the input on my TV over to the other console and played through the same room, then after all the enemies were dead I would switch back and forth and compare the two versions and both versions had an equal amount of blood, gore, and severed limbs on the floor. I didn't notice the limbs disappearing on the PS3 version as they claim they do.

callahan096065d ago

Disagree, eh? Show me evidence if you think I'm wrong. If you've got both versions, do what I did and play them and compare. The PS3 version is gory as hell and it's quite frankly the better version of the game. It plays better, it looks better, and it offers more content.

jimbone6064d ago

I didn't disagree and I really don't care, but really you didn't put up any "Proof" either.

callahan096064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

Proof may be the wrong word. At least an argument. If someone doesn't agree, at least come out and say so and why, make your claim.

jimbone6064d ago

I agree with that, and like I said I wasn't at all trying to bash, but I do feel you. I just got 5 (phantom) disagree's for a completely honest and truthful commit, that my friend is astounding.

IdleLeeSiuLung6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

I do NOT know what you saw as you didn't put out any actual proof I can see, but frankly speaking I played through both and can tell you that there are far more limbs and especially blood on the ground after each fight.

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darkequitus6065d ago (Edited 6065d ago )

I find these coding tricks these engineers use fascinating. Go technical-ish read.

Edit. With the unified shaders of the 360, what TN could have done is reduce the number of characters on screen (to that of the PS3)and spend more on visual detail if the ywere thinking the other way around.

Either way both consoles get a good game, with a bit of swing and round about.

raztad6065d ago

What is lacking in that description is the role of The Cell. W/o a proper use of PS3's cpu highly parallel arch the real power of the PS3 remains untapped.

jimbone6064d ago

In technical terms can you tell me in a percentage of how much of the cell's power they did/didn't use on this game, because I read they had to build it from the ground up for PS3 just because of how different the architecture are. Unless of course you are just on "SDF" duty on an article that said the PS3 version has the edge anyway. Also I was wondering how much you make coding for Sony games since you know more than all these developers do?

raztad6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

How should I know what percentage was used? Did you read the article? did you read my comment? I said that the information about The Cell usage is MISSING.

Curiously enough, just in the right pane there is an article explaining how The Cell was stressed under UC2. It's a good read. It explains very well the importance of The Cell in the rendering process and helping out the RSX.

I know for certain, that GoW3 is using a similar tech. Sony Sata Monica devels were in GDC 09 explaining how to maximize SPUs usage.

jimbone6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

No I still don't see in the article were it says they didn't use the cell at all, I guess its not in my version.

I just read it a 3rd time to make sure I didn't miss anything, and the only thing close they said about it at all was "The Sigma team's solution to these problems is quite ingenious. It simply rebuilt the whole game completely from scratch with its own engine, "remixing" Ninja Gaiden 2 to play more to the strengths of the PS3 hardware."

and then

"Overall, it's intriguing to see just how Team Ninja went about the business of crafting what is essentially the same game, but producing different versions that favor the technological advantages of both platforms."
Nether of which said the Cell wasn't used at all.
How ever I will listen to both sides of a debate, so if you cut and paste the part of the article were they did state that the cell wasn't used at all then I will retract my statements and admit I was wrong.
EDIT: LOL, so then I read your commit again and realized I was saying the same thing you are. There is nothing of how the Cell is used. Sorry man, I had misunderstood you. My Bad.

Jamescagney6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

Tbh raztad I'm sure they were looking at the best ways to utilise the ps3, I doubt they finished porting it thinking 'Damn, what about the The Cell? We didn't use it!'

EDIT:These are professional programmers who know how to make a game, are you saying you know better?

raztad6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

Ok. I guess I missworded my first comment. I meant that in the ARTICLE there is not information about how The Cell was used. I wasnt saying that TN didnt use The Cell. However the lack of references to how they stressed the PS3 cpus make me think that TN didnt exploit the SPUS or the writer has no information about it, but it's all good, TN did an awesome work with Sigma 2, things only can get better from now on. At least they have a fully PS3 tailored engine in place plus the know-how.

Eddie201016064d ago

Are the two of you just bone heads? or is your reading comprehension very poor. raztad did not say they did not use the Cell processor, he said or what he meant is that Digital Foundry did not mention the use of the cell proccessor or how they used it in the article.

How the two of you got that he was saying he new how to program or even that he could program better than the developer is beyond me.

I own and have played the 360 version and also have played the PS3 version, the PS3 version is better than the Xbox 360 version. It has better textures, (some have been redesigned) much better lighting, no screen taring and better resolution along with much more content. The PS3 version is the more balanced of two versions.
It is also a better playing game on the PS3.

MNicholas6064d ago

the engine is clearly tailored to the strengths of the GPU and shows no sign of the kinds of effects enabled by the Cell such as extreme polygon counts, advanced DOF, advanced motion blur, etc...

For some perspective, it took Naughty Dog 4 years to get where they are with using the Cell to accelerate the GPU. They've effectively doubled performance. Guerrila Games have probably reached that point by now as well in their development of Killzone 3. Maybe Polyphony Digital too ... we'll find out soon.

Anyone else?

raztad6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

Sony Santa Monica is another powerhouse, GoW3 will show the latest in Cell BA coding. If I undertand correctly, Sony's first/second party devels share their experiences/tech so I expect UC2/KZ2 visuals to be improved in upcoming games.

That said, it's good to see that Tecmo was able to reach such good visuals in Sigma 2 only using the RSX, thats a very fine coding there.

jimbone6064d ago (Edited 6064d ago )

@ Eddie20101
I agree, I didn't understand what he meant at first, but to be fair you must be just as boneheaded, and poor at comprehension as we were to not notice my edit and follow up response where I did read the commit again and say that we were both trying to say the same thing, then told him sorry about my mistake, 5 hours before your commit. Maybe you should do what I did and read all the commits again and then see if you are man enough to admit you were wrong like i did. (Just a suggestion)

@ MNicholas. Any one else for what? This discussion was about whether or not they used the Cell at all (in NGS2), and I do believe they did. I never said one word about ND or UC2, but I do understand that is a fanboy answer for everything here at N4G. Just to be clear we where talking about the NGS2 article not any of the sh!t you posted about. The conclusion that we all seemed to have come to is that in this article they didn't say one way or the other, but it being rebuilt (or coded) for the PS3 from the ground up I would assume that they did use it in some way, to think other wise IMO is sort of stupid.

Ravage276064d ago

clearly shows that PS3 has absolutely NO problems pushing polygons. Team Ninja clearly didn't utilize the Cell much though i still applaud them for their efforts.

Anyway, i'll take true HD resolution and stable/playable framerates over 1(or 2) more enemies any day. Given a chance to redo the 360 version, i'm pretty sure TN would have capped the enemy count to improve the framerates too, it's a no brainer

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100°

10 Hardest PS3 Games

Tough as nails, solid as a brick, and as annoying as a rooster at dawn—this list has it all. Here are the hardest PS3 games.

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altarofgaming.com
DarXyde576d ago

This list has nine games....

And if these are the "hardest", that's a bit alarming because I'm pretty average and I've managed to 100% more than a third of this list (Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, Hard Corps Uprising, and Catherine).

150°

The Best Hack and Slash Games of All Time on Xbox 360

It's game time!, or is it hacking and slashing time? Doesn't matter! Enjoy the best hack and slash games on the Xbox 360

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altarofgaming.com
darthv721036d ago

....and that's a bad thing how?

343_Guilty_Spark1036d ago

If it ain’t on Sony box it’s bad

autobotdan1036d ago (Edited 1036d ago )

Ninja Gaiden 2 was never multiplat. NG Sigma 2 is a remixed game not the same game at all

darthv721036d ago

Dante's inferno... such a great GoW inspired game. So sad the sequel was canned, it sounded like it was going to be even more epic than the first.

Vits1036d ago

Yeap, classic GoW is still better mechanically. But the aesthetics and atmosphere of Dante's Inferno were just top-notch. Shame it never got a PC port, but at the very least is available on modern Xbox.

Juiceid1036d ago

This list is ok, but Ninja Gaiden reigns supreme!

GhostScholar1036d ago

I just can’t get into the devil may cry series. In my opinion you never feel powerful in those games. The guns are pointless as they only serve to be a flashy part of a combo. DMC was the only one that I could tolerate long enough to beat.

Show all comments (13)
bunt-custardly1233d ago

Nioh games definitely up there at the top alongside Ninja Gaiden BLK.

LoveSpuds1233d ago

There is a decent fan base for the Nioh games, but still think they are criminally overlooked and under appreciated.

I just bought the PS5 collection to replay them again with all their DLC, a sweet collection for my games shelf for sure.

deleted1233d ago

Yea, those gardens haven't been plowed in over 10 years now though. Imagine if they cultivated it, let it grow again.

Starman691233d ago

Amazing what ya can do with a samurai sword lol 🤣

tehpees31233d ago

The honourable mention though.

TheSenorCheese1233d ago

originally it wasn't going to be included because of their take on Samus' character. But the gameplay's actually not bad.

Vits1233d ago

Honestly, I don't know if we can even blame them for that take. Nintendo's Sakamoto was credited as the writer and from what we learned later with the Retro Studios interviews for the Prime series, Nintendo apparently never saw Samus as this stoic badass that most of the west imagined her as. Going as far as describing her as "motherly".

shinoff21831233d ago

Ninja Gaiden was dope but I don't really care for alot of their games.

1233d ago
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