I am not saying that the RSX is bad I was just stating that they need to toss in a good GPU into the next PS.

Sheesh...

Out of who's ass do these articles get pulled out from? A 12 TB disc drive to go into a xbox 720? I'd be surprised if the next generation of games even hit 200 gb let alone 12TB. Sorry but an upgraded bluray with 100GB discs will more than suffice for the next console. How much is a 12TB going to cost MS's bottom line? I mean who here even has a 12 TB hard drive?!

what a joke of a comment, every ps3 owner is sh!t talking in forums about how "inferior" dvd is ( yes i know less space), and now something comes along that could exponentailly increase the storage space of a dvd disk, and now all of a sudden "theres no use" for 12 terrabytes of storage....

how about the fact that theres 12 terrabytes of storage, anyone interested in a 12terabyte blank disk for burning and backing up data onto....i know i am, how about having every game with multiple languages and infinte extras all on the one disk, put me down for that,

p.s i don't own a 360 or ps3 but ps3 peeps make me sick, i for one am very excited about 12t disks

Please don't invert your roles people. I don't wanna see 360 fanboys in the next-gen say that 12TB is needed and I don't wanna see PS3 fanboys say that "Blu-ray will still be fine" next-gen. Lets not be hypocrites

Ten years ago when the PS2 (or even when the Dreamcast) was released nobody could see the need for 50GB storage on an optical disc. What do we have now?

Point being, if the space is available it will be used as long as the processing power and the resolution of the TV can keep up!

What kind of f*cked up name is tha...

Wait... actually I don't want to know.

"Bluray will do for another generation. Sony has really set themselves up well for next gen. Bluray drive, cell technology (Cell 2). Now all they need is a good GPU and a TON of memory."

At first glance it would seem that Sony HAS set themselves up well for the next gen with blu ray, but you seem to be forgetting that they have used a new disc format in each of their three consoles (PSX=CD, PS2=DVD, PS3=BD). Digital downloads seem more likely than 12TB discs for the next gen, but we will see how that goes when combined with lackluster broadband speeds and usage caps.

@ dchalfront - Are you joking? NO GAMES need 12TB of space even with a ton of extras and multiple languages. Blu ray discs are still more than large enough to deal with both of those things with most games not using a full 50GB BD (even most PS3 exclusives). As far as using a 12TB disc for burning data/storage; yeah, that would be nice, but I highly doubt you will be able to afford that technology as it hasn't even come out yet and I doubt MS will be allowing you to burn the discs in the next XBOX.

If blu ray continues to do well, as it has been, then I would expect to see the next XBOX with blu ray or no disc drive. MS and Sony have both made it clear that DD is the future, it's just a matter of how long before that's all we need.

@ IdleLee - Most games still don't use 50GB (almost none of them do), and the jump from a DVD9 to a BD50 is not nearly as tremendous as a jump from a BD50 to 12TB would be.

"what game is ever going to use 12t of space"

Probably none, but the size alone is hardly a detractor. How many PS3 games use the full 50GB?

For the rest of this scenario, I'm glad they used those rampant speculation tags because that it is. That it is.

"how about the fact that theres 12 terrabytes of storage, anyone interested in a 12terabyte blank disk for burning and backing up data onto."

Good on them. That's completely irrelevant to gaming.

No company is going to use 12TBs of space for one game.

This sounds like a bag full of bull,a 12TB disc sounds more science fiction than anything at this stage,the standard PC comes with a 200-500 gigs and this articles s talking about 12TB disc,LMFAO.

MS is going for DD.

Fair enough, but if you start using un-compressed video, textures and music the data blows up quickly. Going from Dual Layer DVD to blu-ray is factor of 5-6. Going from Blu-Ray to 12TB is a factor 24. Not really that much more.

Now MGS 8 can hopefully fit on one disc with both Japanese and English language track! I think it is short sighted to believe that people won't take advantage of the space if it is there....

the "commercial" release is set for 2014. MS will have already released their next console by then. - Strike 1

If this technology can be used on DVDs, it can be used on Blu-ray -Strike 2

Why would MS's NEXT console compete with Sony's CURRENT console? - Strike 3

I'd say this article strikes out

"what a joke of a comment, every ps3 owner is sh!t talking in forums about how "inferior" dvd is ( yes i know less space), and now something comes along that could exponentailly increase the storage space of a dvd disk, and now all of a sudden "theres no use" for 12 terrabytes of storage.... "

So your telling me that there is a use for 12TB in the near future? even though games these days still barely use 25gb of blu-ray storage space, unless its a ps3 exclusive?!
Yeah riiiight... I don't think so buddy.

What's the point in having all that space to burn your media on to if your computer harddrive only has an average of 500gb- 1TB these days? maybe 2TB-4TB at most in the future, but 12TB?! LOL! your pretty much wasting your money on the super dvd disc cause even if you back-up your entire harddrive, your still wasting what? like 80-90% of what you paid for!
wait a tick... You don't even own either console?! so why are you even talking sh1t?!

a jump from DVD9 is yes, about a factor of 6 x, but a jump from 50 GB to 12 TB is not 24, you missed a zero, it's 240 times the size of a 50 GB bluray.....240 times the size of a blu-ray disc. 12 TB is 12,000 Gigs of space....TWELVE THOUSAND Gigs, as opposed to the 50 of a BD? That's a lovely size, but really?

2 Things: 1 being that that's a s**tload of space, and 2 being that the cost of each "disc" has got to make the console that reads it as well as the game itself more out of price range than people would care to admit, especially in a recession.

Blu rays are supposed to be able to go up in size, from what I understand, above and beyond the 50 GB of now, so I see this tech as a pipe dream at the moment, but not inevitable years from now.

As for next gen consoles, I don't think the tech (as Cryos pointed out) of such a disc is viable for a 24-36 month time-frame or cost reduction strategy to implement it logistically. I don't see it happening for next gen.

"but clearly 12TB is way ahead of the consumer per gig curve you know?"

Hardly. With better graphics, comes higher poly counts and higher resolution textures. A single 3D model with 2 million polygons is well over 100MB. But still, having the GPU power to compute a game full of such high details models is still a ways off.

"I am not saying that the RSX is bad I was just stating that they need to toss in a good GPU into the next PS."

Actually, the PS3's GPU is horrible, and so is the Xbox 360's. The CPU cores pick up most of the work. But next generation they are going to need to focus more on the GPU.

"Its just to much, devs would be overwhelmed. "

Nah, file sizes don't overwhelm the dev's lol. It's being restricted to a disc size that does ;).

What happened to digital downloads?

12 TB downloads are the future!

/sarcasm

Whatever.

Until it's built, The writer needs to quit speculating on parts that aren't confirmed on a console.

I bet that when game size where measured in the Kbytes and the word Gigabyte was far from being used a 700MB game (one CD) would have sounded out of this planet. Well guess what? games are starting to hit the 30gb cap and more... Just watch it happen. Games will use 12 tb or close, and probably sooner than you would expect.

The data needed exponentially grows year after year. Besides, if it is a cost effective media, what would it hurt to have 12tb capacity even if it was unused?

And besides, the media is expected to be commercial by 2014... so MS should hold their next XBOX till then. If that happens and this speculations are true, it would be cool for it to have a 12TB capacity disc media, why not?

i bet kojima will find some way to use it

You are correct. I'm not sure what I was thinking, 1TB = 1000GB.

I think I read the article quickly and picked up the number as 24 instead of 240 and it stuck with me.

It still doesn't change the fact that uncompressed data takes up considerably more space and it is not inconceivable that we can use up that space. Twenty years ago, a 1TB drive was inconceivably large and we still manage to outstrip that need already now. If it is there people will use it. As screen resolution goes up, data size increases exponentially.

They will just give us more content assuming development costs doesn't kill it first. Reality is that 5 years from now this technology would just be released, it wouldn't be cost effective to the masses. It will probably take another 5 years if not more for consumer adoption unless it is rejected.

so first they severely underestimate this gen by going with DVD9 and now it looks like they will SEVERELY over-estimate next gen with a 12TB disk. Someone can't seem to get it right.

TDK

this is what I'm talking about, no more Hard Drive for Pc now it all come down physical Disc, btw what Happen to the no need for physical disc for games? and Blue-ray not needed? so this time no more 360 on the horizon :P

you people are stupid, of course no game is going to use up 12 terabytes of space, i couldn't if i tried, but why not make a format now that will remain in use for the next 10 years?, makes sense to me, all i was saying is that as many language packs or extras the developers want could be put on the one disk, all benefits, i never said that the whole 12 terabytes would be used up and the people who assumed that are fu<king dumb <unts, "i doubt microsoft would allow people to burn the disks used in the next xbox", the don't own the tech so they cant do sh!t, shut your uninformed mouth, better storage space on dvd is nothing but good, people are actually upset that a great technological advancement might be made to make blu ray obsolete, i'm all about new tech

well except youre wrong. games arent hitting 30gb of space yet. they need that much data because the speed of a blu ray disc is still slow. they have to layer the same data to compensate for that. if they are finding new tech for old dvd imagine what they can do with the newer blu ray discs.

microsoft for one isnt going to wait till that tech is ready, they have proven they dont like to wait with hddvd. granted they could have learned their lesson, but still.

two there is no evidence showing microsoft even has an interest in this! toshiba worked with sony on the cell but was against them on blu ray. just because a company backs them on one thing does not mean they back each other on everything

thats like saying blu ray is unnecessary because people don't use the whole 50 gig disk, hardly any games do, but when they use 20....it still means they don't have to have 5 dvd disks, so there is a benefit, same with bigger than blu ray capacity....who cares if the whole 12 terabytes isn't used ( which it never will be), but the point is that there is no size limitation...

Kakkoii is the only one that knows what he's talking about

@AKNAA i own a pc and i run crysis warhead maxed whereas you piss weak ps3 couldn't even run it "but but but the cell", my quad core rig is a better gaming machine than any console, and yes disk size is relevant to pc also dipsh!t

Pssh too bad the PS4 will use virtual reality because that's where the future is!

Seriously though the 360 dumb dumbs aren't getting this clearly through. 50GB for blu-ray discs is right NOW the most one needs to really make use of the awesome tech within the PS3 to the bestest you can. 12terrabytes is pointless, because to fill that and make it work you not only need the disc filled with data---you need hardware to make it shine along with it.

IF the next Xbox uses 12TB discs, then the actual Xbox would have to cost more than 1,000 dollars to make use of such a ridiculous amount of space.

you could probably fit the whole 360 library on 12tb of space. 1 disc backwards compatibility...

...what a waste of space.

because there's a difference between tech that will be around in 2014 and the tech that is CURRENTLY being researched for the next gen of consoles. The next generation of consoles is well into its obligatory research cycle, and the cost of implementing such a medium right now is through the roof, not something that can be implemented for a console that is already well underway (all 3 are working on the next gen as of now, not 2014)...

I will never state tech like this is impossible or unnecessary (see my first post), rather, I will stress the fact that this sort of tech is too far down the line for the two most important factors: 'mass-production-availability' and 'cost implementation'...

Neither are possible for the research going on *currently* to make a "mass market friendly console" that is sub $1000. How much do you think a game would market for on a 12 TB disc? $60? $100? a grand? more?

Only way this is going to make next gen is if next gen consoles will be pre-equiped for such expandability and upgradability. Until then, it's not in the time frame needed for marketing into the millions at consumer level prices.

12tb?!?! why not just go with hvd tech...cant that supposedly hold 4tb of space...thats good enough for next gen, right?

plus havent ppl been playing around with hvd tech for awhile now...surely there must have been some kind of break through...lol

my god how stupid!!!!!

" i own a pc and i run crysis warhead maxed whereas you piss weak ps3 couldn't even run it "but but but the cell", my quad core rig is a better gaming machine than any console, and yes disk size is relevant to pc also dipsh!t "

YAWWWN...???... dude, just go back to your computer desk, sit on your uncomfortable comp. chair and play your crysis whorehead on your mini comp. screen and just shut the f%$K up! and I will go back to my Fun, but piss weak PS3 exclusive games okay... Hmmm, makes me kinda wonder what you think about wii and 360 now that I think about it?!

Pioneer has created a 1600GB BDR and it too is mulit-layered and stacked dimensionally on the same disk.

Right so, Bluray beat the HDDVD but MS could have retained it for the 360 and for their next console. If they had have done this then PS3 and 360 gamers wouldn't have to endure crippled and cropped multi-plats.

Would anyone out there have any faith in another disc based format that MS supported? I think not. They ditched the original Xbox and this Gen when the movie studios started to fall in behind Bluray they ditched the HD DVD format when it would have been still useful for their console.

Any quotes MS and Co. make about disc based storage is just an attempt to confuse future adopters of the Bluray format.

gameplayer.com.au has no credibility when it comes to anything related to Sony and MS unless its some fluff piece about MS.

As for larger storage, I’m for any tech that gives us more storage, whoever develops or produces it.

You see lots of these "we found a way of fitting 300 DVD's on on DVD"

Well if the system works for a DVD it will work on a Blu-ray.

.

-Bill Gates

Seriously though, I think that disk size is a bit overkill...

This site is horrible. They constantly swear in their articles and try and tear down SONY and Nintendo.

The new format is not needed, unless its not going to be used for entertainment media such as movies.

M$ cannot put consumers through another format battle, people will start to resent the game industry.

"thats like saying blu ray is unnecessary because people don't use the whole 50 gig disk"

Blu-ray disks are 25GB single layer.

"hardly any games do,"

Hardly any games implies that some do, which is true (MGS4) however that is a lot different then no game ever will use 12 TB.

"but when they use 20....it still means they don't have to have 5 dvd disks, so there is a benefit, same with bigger than blu ray capacity....who cares if the whole 12 terabytes isn't used ( which it never will be), but the point is that there is no size limitation..."

Yes, first Blu-ray disks are varying in size and second if you can fit a game onto a Blu-ray disk or a 12 TB disk, which one are you going to use? The cheaper one, which will be the blu-ray disk.

You people will read anything.

12TB discs coming even in 2014 won't be available for consumers to touch for another decade. Price of something like that would be enormous.

Microsoft will use 100-400 GB HVD discs. They can play Blu-Ray discs and also use HVD. Promised to reach up into 3-4 TB range, but so far only 100 GB discs ready for consumers to use with 200-400 GB discs coming soon. Terabytes range is still years off for them though. Maybe in next 2 years we will see some progress though. Microsoft will not fold into using Blu-Ray as their disc format. They will use HVD. It is their only option. 2014 would be too far away and even if HVD came out with a 4 TB disc they wouldn't use it as its price would be insanely high. I doubt they would even use 1 TB. 100-400 GB is more than enough for anyone.

Sony will use Blu-Ray with up to 400 GB discs as its confirmed a new format for Blu-Ray coming in 2010 that uses 16 layers worked on any Blu-Ray Player including the PS3 even. Also with 1 TB discs coming in 2011-2013 with same tech so it would have potential for growing, but I doubt any growth is really needed. A little is fine, but too much would be to expensive.

This is by far the most retarded articles out of many, many retarded articles from gameplayer.com. That site is total garbage.

Am i the only one who thinks that this article it's been written by a 12 year old 360-fanboy???
It's like this little boy says in a childish way "what? sony has 50GB disc storege???
well you know what... eem... MS will built a 12TB one"!!!!

come on... be serious for once... 12TB???? why dont microsoft just build a 1TB which is PLENTY at this point and leave the rest for the future???

and dont hesitate to call me PS3fanboy cause i only own a 360.... for now. :p

MICROSOFT WILL COME OUT WITH 9999999 TB STORAGE DEVICE THAT WILL HOLD ALL THE INFORMATION OF THE WORLD ON ONE SINGLE DISC THE SIZE OF A QUARTER AND SONY WILL BE LEFT IN THE DUST!!! Give me a break, they just came out with 1 TB hard drives let alone 12 TB discs, what a load of crap. Good luck with that. Stupid article.

Goes for changable Hard drive and Disk drive and you have option to fit BLU Ray or DVD whatrever you like, plus if its broken you can get a new Drive rather than a whole console, and they give full HDD install like PC. This will be really good for consumers.

Ya true but it at least gives dev enough room lol, PLENTY of room. But its there, they dont have to use up all the space people, not every dev uses up BR space so does that make it a waste?

12TB is the total space on the drive, not the size of the game. You could fit the 360's and PS3's entire library of games and all DLC on 12TB drive. Things like this spark alot of fear in PS3 fans because Blu-ray is the PS3's biggest selling point, even though it's not helping to much.

why doesn't the author just say that the xbox 720 will have infinite crystal storage and holographic vr games. I'm sure that will blow away bluray and the PS3... last time I checked, though. this is reality and there is more of a chance of MS breaking down and supporting blu-ray in the 720.

Did you even read anyone's replies here or did you just skim it because that's easier? NO console manufacturer can implement such tech like this for a console that is already being developed, that has nothing to do with "Bluray superiority complex" or whatever else you're going on about. It's not cost-feasible or mass-production friendly, how much do you think a console reading a disc like that costs to manufacture for the target release years of 2011/12, let alone the games burned on them?

So, Microsoft was too cheap to shell out for a next gen disk format this time around; So next time they will jump 3 gens ahead with a new format?

Also, one of the things that made Bluray viable was its use as a high definition video format for movies at a time when high def televisions are becoming the norm. There is no resolution within human visibility that justifies a 12 terabyte disk for a movie!

lol. I love how you get all bent out of shape so easily. What a typical nerd! I was saying that MS won't allow the discs to be burned using the XBOX, because they DO OWN the XBOX and WILL control what goes into it (or comes out of it). So, now you can "shut your uninformed mouth", kid. BTW, have fun not playing Crysis maxed out on your PC. We've all heard that one before from every different kind of fanboy out there.

Who cares!? Lol.
That would guarantee that no games would be cut back because of disc space..

Lol, uncomfortable computer chair and small screen? What, are you living in the 80's?

Firstly, there are tons of computer "chairs" that are way more comfortable than anything you've probably sat your ass on. And PC monitors have become quite big. Regular size now is 20-30 inch. And you can get 1920x1200 resolution screens :P, That's 1200p :). (Or if you have the cash 2560x1600.)

So you enjoy your 720p and sometimes 1080p gaming with low graphics settings and having to sit in the living room. And I'll enjoy my much higher than high def gaming in my super freaking comfy computer chair on my 23inch 1200p LCD screen in the comfort of my own room. With access to everything else on my computer such as the internet, chat and music while I'm gaming with much higher graphics settings than you could ever hope to experience.

would you stop with the lies, man blu ray is selling good but its nowhere near outselling standard dvd in any shape or form. I understand you like blu ray but would you just stop the BS an maybe do some reasearch before you say certain things an act like its true!

http://www.betanews.com/art...

It would be stupid for microsoft to make a new disc just for gaming in the next xbox and here is why. By the time the next xbox is released bluray will still be around and will still be the only dominate hd movie format around. So because it will still be the only choice for HD movies then why would microsoft not include a bluray drive in the next xbox?
The smart choice is to just include a bluray drive so that it will play movies and all the games.
If their is a memory problem or if 50 GB is not enough then 500 GB's is surely enough for next next gen games because they are currently making a new bluray disc that holds that much data that can still be played in normal bluray drives.

"Thus far, these two areas have been weak for Blu-ray. The format's attribute-based benefits (i.e., picture and sound quality, bonus material quality) have repeatedly been called into question, and even though the stable of relevant supporters is substantial (Dell, Samsung, LG, Apple, Sony to name only a few) there is a colossal presence absent from the Blu-ray party: Microsoft."

Agreed. HD-DVD is no more and might have had less space but it was a heck of a lot better and packed way more features than bluray.

Funny how he just admitted he's an Irate HD-DVD fanboy. Way to blow all his credibility in the last paragraph. Should have just blown it in the first, so nobody would bother reading this junk!

I don't really think they were comparing this gen to the next-gen.
I think they were just comparing formats..

Cause, obviously, you would expect, Sony will use blu-ray next-gen, as well.

do care to state what u disagree about so we can have a convo and seeh ow smart u are.

I highly doubt that they could use an NXE kind of update,
Or any kind of update to make the drive read these new DVDs..

But, I don't know.. I'm not tech savvy, or whatever. Lol.

50 gb isn't the limit either. They are working on a BD that has 250gb of storage, plenty for next-gen.

Samsung is a board member!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

"which *SPECULATES that Microsoft and Samsung could partner up with technology that allows up to 12TB of storage on one physical disc."

*Speculates: a message expressing an opinion based on incomplete evidence.

First off, I'm not asking as flame bait, just to make it clear. Lol.

But, how many games have gone remotely close to filling up the whole Blu-Ray?
The only one I know of is MGS4.. Are there any other games?
Or, is MGS4 what you were referring to?

Nevermind, just saw your second post. =P
Do you know of any games that are due to release shortly that are reaching the border?