I recon the Xbox 360 Arcade is a great value compared what I consider it's main competitor, the PS2. It can do everything the PS2 can do just better with an upgrade path at a very attractive and close price point to the PS2. Now the PS2 large game library is unmatched though by any current system though.

People that complain about the hard drive is mistaken about who the 360 Arcade is really competing against. The majority of people that consider an Arcade aren't going to consider PS3 due to the high price point, but rather look at the Wii and the PS2. Neither which have a hard drive, neither which can do HD gaming and neither have any significant online gaming support.

You honestly think that the 360 arcade is "competing" with the PS2? If so, I have to disagree. Microsoft is probably trying to get consumers that are upgrading from their PS2 that they already own to go the XBOX360 route, but they are definitely trying to compete with the Wii. The PS2 is half the price of 360 arcade, so I would hardly say they are "close" in cost.

I thought MS opted to surface mount 256mb of memory to accommodate the NXE? It was done in all new arcade systems as far as I recall. This way they didnt have to include a memory unit. You would think that if the same board is used in all three systems that even the new elites and pro's would have an extra 256mb or mem on board for storage.

Ms has a stockpile of 20gb hdd and should just make all arcade sku's come with a 20gb drive. When Ms stopped making the 20gb premium (pro) as well as the individual 20gb packaging, the drive had to go someplace. Logically they should have gone to the arcades.

"I think that's who MS is going after with the Arcade...casual Wii owners who might want to dip their toe into HD gaming..."

I think MS's Strategy is working but it could be doing better given the price advantage.

This might come down to a price-war...

Agreed, but the on-board storage (or included memory card in older packages) makes it a logically complete, functional system.

But MS should have done a MUCH better job with hard drives instead of this screwy proprietary scheme. Why can't we save games on USB or use our own drives? It's a little stupid.

Why do they always have to use 3rd party games??? They should just throw in Banjo Kazooi or however you spell it. It's probably better than this crap.