1240°

Editorial: Microsoft's Answer To Blu-Ray Is DMD

Whether you call it downloadable content, game add-ons or digital media distribution, the new wave of accessing information for console games is drastically evolving thanks to die-hard efforts of Microsoft and Sony. The industry is continually finding ways to break out of the reliance of hard-copied media formats. And even though both Microsoft and Sony are vying to gain exclusives with their respective online services, Microsoft has taken things a step further for the sake of keeping the Xbox 360 alive in 2009.

It's no surprise that the Xbox 360 is showing its age every year on the market. Toss in the fact that between the red rings of doom and the disc scratching fiasco, the Xbox 360 isn't looking future proof at all.

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LightningPS3PS36236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

because atleast it acknowledges that blu ray is finally beginning to take off. That's the difference between day and night for the PS3.

This obviously isn't the first time that blu ray gets written off because of digital downloads. And it won't be the last.

Comparing, digital downloads for movies vs blu ray and then talking game content is confusing the situation for me.

Both PS3 and XBOX 360 are providing plenty of downloadable game content. PS3 is and has with Little Big Planet, Motorstorm, Dead Space, 360 obviously has the infamous GTA IV episodes.

The XBOX 360 199 sku doesn't even have a hard drive and it's selling pretty good, where does that play into all this future talk?

BattleAxe6236d ago

If all they use on their next system is DMD, then the games are going to have to be small- medium size. That means that MS is going to go casual next time around. They've watched Nintendo take the world by storm and I'm betting thats where MS is heading.

thewhoopimen6236d ago

MS is DooMD if they think they can just wish their way into a new format.

PAPERCHASER03966236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

With the current internet speeds we have, this idea would be in the distant future my first question would be servers and how many because say you get a huge release and 500,000 people or more are trying to download on release day how do the servers handle that magnitude or more

edit* And cable company and providers will also clean up with the cost to you to provide and maintain satisfying speeds

meepmoopmeep6236d ago

i would like to inform everyone that i do not write the articles i submit

i'm not this stupid.
:)

MorganX6236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

All I have to say is, I have more Blu-ray movies than PS3/360 Games and DVDs. And I want more ...

I've loaned more movies than games. That's why MS and everyone else wants DMD. Azzholes. Can't loan a DRM'd DMD. Can't trade it in. Can't sell it. No way to screw you into paying for it twice if your crappy console dies and your license gets hosed.

Physical media is dead, Long live physical media!

UltimateIdiot9116236d ago

Totally agree with you there. I love physical media because I can loan it and it's filled with bonus content (bluray). Not only that, I enjoy looking through my collection and letting other know what I have. I can't do that with DMD. I can't show my friends what games I have through DMD.
I like tangible items, and I can trade with my friends or sell it if I don't want it anymore. I wish I could sell back some of DD but I can't.

Jake11116236d ago

T4 can now download at 274MB/sec. Therefore a 50Gig game would take 3 mins.

I love the PS3 and Sonys blue ray but they must be taking into consideration that hard drives are going to be huge in the next few years and download speed will push up to T4 in developed countries.

shamusl936236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

T4 is completely unrealistic for the US or other countries at this point. You also fail to realize that Hard Drives have a maximum throughput much, much lower than T4 internet speeds (about 50-100 MB/S MAX), and the speed of servers on the other end. Just because you have a T4 line doesn't mean your going to be getting anything close to T4 download speeds, most data centers (whole centers that everyone would share to download that content) have about 10-20 T4 lines currently. T4 would also not reach most parts of the country, most parts of the country don't even have broadband (anything faster than dial up).

I have one of the fastest residential connections in the US (30 Mbit/s, about 3.5 MB/S), and pay 85 dollars for it. T4 usually costs in the tens of thousands of dollars a month right now, and for the last few years, with no foreseeable decrease in price in the near future. Your argument is invalid.

hfaze6236d ago

Ummm... not quite so for a T4 line...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

A T4 (which is not common at all) runs at 274.176 Mbit/s using 4032 64Kbit/sec channels. That works out to 34.27Mbytes/sec, not 274Mbytes/sec. Remember, there's 8 bits in a byte...

The only carrier type that can give those kind of speeds would be an OC-48 at 2488.32 Mbit/sec (311.04Mbytes/sec).

Now, keep in mind that a T3 (45Mbit/sec) typically runs around $7,000/Mo. (I priced it out in the Philadelphia area for my last job)

Granted, Verizon was offering 50Mbit/sec down, 20Mbit/sec up (6.25Mbytes/sec down, 2.5Mbytes/sec up) FiOS service in the Philly area, but even that was $145/Mo.

http://www22.verizon.com/Re...

I would say that it will be a WHILE before residential connections even come close to those speeds at a reasonable cost.

mikeslemonade6236d ago

DMD that is so stupid. I can't see myself saying the word DMD it sounds stupid.

thereapersson6235d ago

Do you know how EXPENSIVE T4 is? It isn't even viable on a consumer level in the US, which is the 360's major market.

One of the dumbest posts I've seen in a while.

Sergeant Osiris6235d ago

signing deals with movie studios to stream 1080p deep color first run films to the 360. Obviously they don't have any competent engineers to tell them that due to bandwidth limitations, availability of broadband, and ISP greed. This plan has EPIC FAIL written all over it.

SonyOwnsNextYear6235d ago

DMD will fail JUST like HDDVD.

i told you hddvd would fail, way back when execs were saying they were beating bluray at every turn.

Smoke and mirrors, people...thatsall microsoft has banked on this generation.

Megatron086235d ago

1st off known ps3 fanboy site. 2nd the writer seems to to have no cluing about whats goin on in game. "If Microsoft can stave off the masses from accelerating PS3 sales" Does this idoit not know that the 360 sold almost 900k in nov while the ps3 sold a lil over 300k ? Yeah thats mass selling alright but it all being done by MS not sony. 3rd a lil over a week away from 09 and he sayin there be a new xbox in 10 if there was going to be an new xbox in 2010 we'd heard of it already ms announced the 360 2 years b4 it came out sony announced the ps3 3 years before it came out.

Oh and as for DMD or DD failing like blu ray will. Well its already proven that it going no where its been around for 15-20 years DD music as almost put an end to CD's DD'ing games is finally starting to take off. Btw for all the sony fanboys out there sony was one of the 1st companies to do DD games. back in 2000 sony release the 1st expansion to EQ that you could only get on disc by special order other then that you had to DD it. So in a way MS is just expanding on something sony started. I'm bet by the time the next systems come out there will be a lot of games that you can only get by DD on both the sony and ms systems

hfaze6235d ago

"Oh and as for DMD or DD failing like blu ray will. Well its already proven that it going no where its been around for 15-20 years"

Really... Digital distribution has been around since 1988? (20 years ago) Wow... I wonder how long it took to download an MP3 at 1200/2400 baud?

Illegal digital distribution of music has been around since 1995. I remember playing around with WinAMP 1.0 back then, and downloading MP3's off of private FTP sites back then. LEGAL digital distribution of music didn't hit mainstream until Apple's iTunes store opened up in 2003.

"DD music as almost put an end to CD's DD'ing games is finally starting to take off."

Well... DD music didn't start putting a dent into CD sales until broadband became common for consumers. Yeah, people were downloading music before that, but it would take about an hour per song (at 56k modem speeds).

The reason it works well for music is because MP3's (or .flac, .aac, .ogg music files) are SMALL (~3-8MB/song), and current commodity Internet connections (cable modems, DSL, satellite, hell even 3G mobile connections like EVDO rev. A, HSDPA, and UMTS) have the bandwidth capacity to make those downloads quick and convenient.

When you start talking about movie/show and FULL game downloads, you're talking about file sizes an order or magnitude larger than music downloads. Even with compression, you're talking about multi-gigabyte downloads. It is just not quite convenient yet.

Take for example downloading the contents of a single-layer DVD. You're talking about 4.7GB of data. Even at 8Mbit (the current highest bandwidth cable modem and DSL commonly available here in the US), you are still talking about 80 minutes and 21 seconds to download that data, and that's assuming you are pulling the full 8Mbit your connection can handle (which rarely, if ever, happens).

Once consumer Internet connections @ 50Mbit/sec are common, THEN I can see digital distribution of movies, shows, and full games start becoming a feasible reality. That would put a 4.7GB download at around 12.5 minutes (once again, assuming a full 50Mbit download the entire time). While consumer 50Mbit connections are available at this time (Verizon FiOS here in the states), they are FAR from commonly available.

Not to mention, you have cable carriers and telephone companies putting bandwidth caps on consumer Internet connections, charging you for any overages... Just imagine downloading three full games (8.7GB, the capacity of a dual-layer DVD) in a month, along with online gaming, then getting your broadband bill the next month and discovering that your bill DOUBLED for that month due to going over your limit.

Digital Distribution of movies/shows and full games is not going to die, it's just not quite ready for prime-time yet.

jackel 926235d ago

But my one and only concern is that if you compare the average American internet speed it is still sluggish(about 4 mbps), either ms will have to offer there own internet that is close to japans average of 60mbps then I can see dmd taking off.

f7897906235d ago

Not fight for bandwidth for 48 hours for a game I cannot resell.

Megatron086235d ago (Edited 6235d ago )

hfaze so you whole agruement is base off the fact that in late 90's early 00's that it was slow to download music and you are right about that I remember it takin 5-10mins even up 15 mins to download songs using dail up. Right now I'm using a slow ass crappy dsl. With that I can still download 1 gb in less then 30 min off my 360 and stream movie off netflix (takes like 1min to buff). Hell it takes like 20mins to install blu ray disc to a ps3 and you still have to use it mainly off the disc and it still has the same loading times a 360 using a dvd drive. Plus the next system wont be out for another 3-4 years. Now take into account moore's law. Plus you didnt take anything in to account for compression. You could compress 9gb into 1gb 20 gbs becomes 2gb even with a slow ass dsl that like 1 hour download. Its funny how you are against DD of game and a sony fanboy when sony is the one pushing this tech more then anyone else. Way back in 2000 they release EQ RoK that you could DD the ps3 is only system that lets you DD whole "next gen" games. Sony would drop blu ray so fast if they could get everyone to buy DD movies.

F7 thats right you cant resell them and you wonder why sony wants to DD games so much and MS and even the big N

SaiyanFury6235d ago (Edited 6235d ago )

*yawn*

Here we go again with this DD spin. You want to download a 10GB game to your 360's HDD? Great, I hope your not one of the cheapies that bought the 200 dollar arcade unit. Even if you weren't I hope you're not planning on playing that game you're trying to download in the next 4-5 days because 10GB is a lot of information to get in case you weren't aware of that. Oh yeah, I hope MS is planning a 320GB model HDD to be available because HD video games take up a lot of space. Think 120GB is a lot? Download 10-20 HD games and see how fast that space fills up. On top of that I hope MS makes it a little more affordable than their 120GB HDD priced at 150 dollars.

It always comes back to internet infrastructure. Most people do not have the connection speed to make DMD or DD or whatever they want to call it today a viable means of delivering games. I just recently downloaded the A-Team DVD rips which totalled 33GB. That took me 2 weeks to get on a connection speed of 1.5mbps. Most people are on faster connections yes, but considering the sheer size of games these days, even those faster connections wouldn't be good enough. Metal Gear Solid 4 is 50GB, how long would that take to download on a connection of say, 10mbps? I'd still assume a long time and that's IF your ISP doesn't cap your download bandwidth. With the recent trend of ISPs throttling bandwidth DD isn't even conceivable. People who still argue that Blu-ray isn't the best form of high capacity deliverance of this generation simply don't have a view of the bigger picture. Everyone else does.

MorganX6235d ago (Edited 6235d ago )

Good point no one seems to ever mention. ISPs greed is leading to a rise in bandwidth caps. So much for en masse DDs even if the bandwidth was there, ISPs will cap it trying to extort more money out of users.

There are reasons why PDFs didn't kill print media, and DD won't kill disc media. I mean, even BD-Live is rather meaningless to me. I have my movie, extras, deleted scenes, alternate endings. I really have no use for BD-Live. If I want to watch a movie with someone I'll do it in person or on the phone. Who wants to type while watching a movie. And let's remember, Microsofts DDs are stereo or plain old DD 5.1. Forget about downloading uncompressed audio or even DTS-MA, which of course Xbox cannot decode anyway.

Pika-pie6235d ago

MS next console being DMD only. There are still many homes that dont have broadband, even areas of certain countries (even in the UK) that cant get it.

But MS dont have much choice, they either go Blu (providing Sony lets them use their tech) which would mean that every console sold would also result in extra cash in Sonys pocket (bitter ironey). Or come up with their own format which could be very expensive.

+ Show (19) more repliesLast reply 6235d ago
Corepred46236d ago

is something that's always been there since almost launch? No way. True it will help with smaller games but what happens when a gigantic game comes out that needs a lot of room. Are people with Xbox's supposed to download the whole game to their HDD? That HDD will run out of room really quick, isn't their max size like 120 gig? This is in no way an answer for Blu-Ray. Microsoft needs to switch to Blu or find something else but DMD is not the answer.

Danja6236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

DMD will never replace a physical disc , some ppl prefer to have a physical format.

as for gaming DMD wil always be an after thought disc based games will never die because , but i can DMD getting more popular as time goes on since the PS3 has already showed that ppl are willing to buy full games online..

but who the hell is gonna gonna downloading X amount of GB is just lame..not to mention the HDD wouldn't even be able to hold 10 games ...plus to include game saves on HDD...

INehalemEXI6236d ago

120 GB , could not even fit 3 games if those games where the size of say ...MGS4.

Shane Kim6236d ago

I can go for downloading PSN games, but no way in hell am I downloading "x" GB's of data. I want hard copy on my stuff and my connection is to slow. I can't be waiting 2 days just to download my game.

BrunoM6236d ago

downloads are good (for some things) but come on i and like lets say 85% of every one else love to have on their hand what they pay for .. and humm about 8Mil people with 360s dont have an HDD...

(AND just on a side note as far as download games even SONY dosent stand like microsoft does sony is the one gaving the most FULL GAMES IN FULL HD humm is it only me but some company to stand by something they have to gave it i dont see microsoft doing it . kinda weird humm stand by something that th other company is doing better even tho they dont wanna go that way.!) lol

drdistracto7076236d ago

hehe, dmd will never replace the power of blu, hell, the 400 gb bluray disc coming next year is bigger than our f*ckin harddrive

xwabbit6236d ago

This would be good for ps3 cus we can get 500GB HDD for 120 bucks loL.

phosphor1126236d ago

download a 1080p movie...at 11 Gigs each...

My point is (like many other people's) is that DMD won't get it far. Compressed DVD movies run about 700 in .avi format. That's decent, but since this article is trying to say DMD is the answer to bluray (for the 360 that is) then that means it will have to answer to the larger game sizes that won't fit on a DVD9 (8 gigs available to devs [the last gig is used for mandatory MS data crap]). So lets say, a 15 gig game...that would be fun to download right? DMD isn't the answer, and it wont be for several years..not until the US gets better broadband that is.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 6236d ago
Angrychinchilla6236d ago

*looks at current bandwidth*

*shakes head in disapproval *

user8586216236d ago

funny thats their answer yet sony are the ones to release full games online, ohhh and btw ermmmm dark knight got to 2 million now!! where has dmd got 2?? :)

blackbeld6236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

DMD(digital media download) hahahaha this is another fail.
I like it simple just plugin and play games not having to wait 1hour or more before you actualy can play games.. this is stupid!

Sonyfanclubpresident6236d ago

with continued exclusive content for big-name games and media, then they'll be standing on the perfect plateau for expanding the Xbox brand with a new console in 2010.

Why waste time purchasing a PS3 now?
If a new 360 is coming out in 2010......that will literally destroy anything Sonys old PS3 can do,there's no point in getting it at all.

As always,Sony plays behind tsk tsk tsk.

na2ru16236d ago

You effectively admitted it. The xbox has INDEED aged. PS3 wont lose support from devs. Devs will NOT be bothered to waste EVEN MORE time advancing with their polygonal rendering and texture designs when this gen has reached an acceptable standard in visual quality. You will not see any difference so soon in 2010.

lokiroo4206236d ago (Edited 6236d ago )

This should be titled microsoft's answer to the gun is leather armor.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 6236d ago
ultimolu6236d ago

1. People would still like the option of physical media.
2. The slow internet speeds around here can't handle that.

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40°

An Update to Our Shared Commitment to Safer Gaming

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110°

There's an Underrepresented Majority That Wants Entertainment Without Agendas, Says Ex Tripwire CEO

Ex-Tripwire CEO John Gibson shares his 'Entertainment First' vision to capture the agenda-free magic of classics like Star Wars, Zelda, and Metroid.

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Goodguy012d ago

Yes. Just make a good game instead of worrying it should make some kind of stupid social/political differences in the world... we've got enough of that in the real world. Games are places we can escape to and just have fun.

z2g2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

How about you make a game that’s important to you and the people who are interested in that buy it and the ones that don’t like it don’t have to buy it. Just because something bugs some people doesn’t mean there aren’t other people who it doesn’t bug. Someone’s hangups shouldn’t be other people’s problems.

Don’t want a game that features a political or cultural statement or an underrepresented group of people? Don’t buy it.

Not all of us just want vapid, mindless fantasy all the time. Sometimes we want something that represents us or means something. There’s nothing wrong with that. Look how many movies in the world have covered so many types of stories, people or historical controversies to huge successes. Games are no different.

Eonjay2d ago

The plot to remove representation or ideas and content that you dont approve of is an agenda within itself. Its also censorship. People need are trapped in this main- character syndrome where they believe that the world and all of its happens are fashioned for them alone.

crazyCoconuts2d ago

"Don't buy it"
Exactly what people do.
And then big companies are reminded why if you want to make money you may not want to do things like villainize half your market. If you want to preach one side of an argument you're gonna lose people. At least do the Deus Ex/GTA thing and show the warts on both sides so everyone has something to agree with

senorfartcushion2d ago

We’re still waiting on that Splinter Cell remake…

raWfodog2d ago

On the flip side of that, good games can have characters of different ethnic and social backgrounds without thinking that some agendas are trying to be pushed. I've played many, many great games throughout my life with many different characters (male, female, white, people of color, even some animal characters) and loved them all simply for the story and entertainment they provided me while I escaped into those worlds.

senorfartcushion2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

That’s not possible.

Being a child doesn’t remove the political points of OLD GAMES, we were just kids. In fact, older media was decidedly more political than some of the cowardly, childish efforts we have today.

This is precisely why we are still to get that Splinter Cell remake. We can’t have a fun Splinter Cell game with AAA graphics because a few virgins don’t want “politics in their games.”

neutralgamer19922d ago

Keep gaming free of nonsense. Agenda pushing in social media age has gotten worst

senorfartcushion1d 7h ago

Name a game and I’ll tell you what the agenda was

Notellin1d 21h ago

"While our first game is faith-based"

Yeah you guys want to get rid of all the politics and play a nice Southern Baptist game. We get it.

Christopher1d 19h ago

He should follow his own words, then.

*** That changed around two years ago, when he started consulting for Bible X, the studio behind the Christian-based game project Gate Zero. Last month, Gibson, through his recently established publisher Templar Media, acquired the developer.***

Not sure there's anything more political in history than religion.

S2Killinit1d 16h ago

But his statement is also an agenda. Hope people are intelligent enough to know that.

+ Show (5) more repliesLast reply 1d 7h ago
z2g2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

I fail to see how representing actual underrepresented or making them feel included is an “agenda”. This is an extremely self centered selfish viewpoint. Those actual underrepresented people just want to be recognized as valid. The privileged majority who are always represented take that for granted and can’t deal with the fact that “other” types of people or views exist. Inclusion or awareness isn’t an agenda. It’s representing reality and making those “other” people or stories be seen and align with actual reality.

There are literally thousands and thousands of games to choose from, and if you are annoyed that some have cultural or topical relevance, that’s your problem and you don’t have to buy them. Meanwhile other people who want that actually have games that speak to them. So sick of this “my way or the highway” attitude.

And there are plenty of games out there, if that privileged majority have an issue or don’t want a game based on cultural relevance. Pick up a Switch. Most games are g-rated, noncontroversial cartoons with stories fit for tweens. No reality to get mad at.

2d ago Replies(2)
KyRo2d ago

It's always me me me me me with you lot. There's a difference between representation and forcing it for the sake of forcing something to a very very loud but very small minority.

Christopher2d ago

You really are only proving their point with this sort of response to the idea of people feeling included in some games versus the plethora of games without it.

Outside_ofthe_Box2d ago

We need to define what "forcing" is because I've seen people say things like Aloy being female in Horizon is pushing an agenda or catering to a "very very loud but very small minority" before.

dveio2d ago

@z2g

I personally think you've nailed it here.

For decades, wether in film or music, there had been ONE primary target group.

And if you're looking further, even in economy, laws, courts or any other area there had been only one target group.

While others, let's be real, were surpressed.

It's "funny" though - why do we all think personalities like David Bowie, Mick Jagger, Freddy Mercury, etc., have had such a huuuge impact on cultures and society? Because they were 1:1 depicts of the Demon Slayer or the Duke?

No, because they were different. Because we all are different.

The only people time and time again that are complaining, whining and moaning about everything (while highly likely even been a fan of Queen or something) are prejudiced people.

Are people that "But it's never been any different, and I want it to stay that way!".

There's nothing highly hidden here. It's always been the same. After decades, even centuries of rules written by and for the "one primary target group", they are now the loudest that complain & moan.

Inverno2d ago

Y'all could also, ya know, just not buy games you feel have an agenda? This constant bitching coming from all these whiney men every time they see a game that isn't catering to them specifically is tiring. They latch themselves onto these games and throw endless amounts of harassment as if there aren't another thousand games releasing before/around/after. I'm usually outspoken when it comes to forced diversity in games, but the issue here is you're all bigoted as hell and need to learn to be a little less offended. Y'all become the snowflakes you mocked so much lol.

MrDead2d ago

This guy is one of the biggest most delicate snowflakes out there, I'm sure he'll be crying on Tucker Carlson or Fox "News" again soon.

Michiel19891d 20h ago

@christopher cater to and include are two very different things. Played most of the games you mentioned and had no issue with any of em because they just include it. I have no issue with inclusion of that, but if in the next god of war, Kratos would all of a sudden hyperfocus on being a strong independent man or a hypermasculine one, I would give them shit for it as well. It has nothing to do with the inclusion of x or y group, but about the integrity of the game.

@inverno stop putting words in my mouth . It's actually the opposite of what you say, I said there can be no conversation because as soon as you criticize them, a whole angry mob comes at you and tries to cancel you. Thankfully it's become less and less over time and people actually realize now they can voice their opinion without having the fear of losing their job.
You really can't see that a lot of companies are now backpeddalling about the woke bs? They finally realize making your product worse to cater to a group who doesn't buy your product anyway is terrible.

Michiel19892d ago ShowReplies(4)
PitbullMonster1d 15h ago

Who was crying about kingdom come deliverance, Stellar Blade and the first descendant? White Hetero men Or leftards?

Inverno1d 3h ago

Leftards but those games still went on to release and become financially and critically successful. This dood, who was a CEO, went on social media to voice an opinion that at the time was controversial. Just cause you have freedom of speech and expression doesn't mean you hafto always voice your opinions publicly. He had to step down because it was more about the company than just him. Now he's back talking bout "unrepresented majority", as if there aren't different audiences to cater to. Since people from both sides can't seem to escape getting fired for voicing opinions then I guess everyone's got to equally face the consequences of their inability to shut up.

MrBaskerville2d ago (Edited 2d ago )

Star wars, anti agenda? Lol. I don't think Lucas would agree.

Inverno2d ago

One of the most politically charged movies in existence. They can pretend it's all about space wizards with swords but the space nazis are still in the movies and they're still the bad guys. It's ironic as hell.

JEECE2d ago

More evidence that if the agenda feels legitimate within the story's world, people don't even notice that it is an agenda and they don't complain.

Elit3Nick2d ago

This one gave me a chuckle, too.

JEECE2d ago

As ever, this is a misguided expression of the speaker's issue. While of course there are some games (pure puzzle games, etc) that have no agenda, any game with a narrative is conveying some type of message. What people who say they don't like "woke" or "politics in games" actually mean is that they don't like hamfisted, poorly written narratives/characters that are thin veneers for modern political messages that feel out of place in the game's universe. It's why all these people complain about the Veilguard and not Baldur's Gate 3. They both have "woke" characters but in BG3 they feel like they belong in the universe, while in the Veilguard they just feel like generic fantasy skins for modern American 20-somethings.

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