I know I'm raging at this

Sony were open as a book last gen, now they are crawling back in their shell...what the f***

Now I'm not getting it and I wish I never bought Fallout 4

Pricks

I don't believe Bethesda really ever had any intention of adding mods on PS4.

Wow this ticks me off, I was really hoping to play mods on f4.

Sony you fd up

Like it was in the past, the company that have an advantage in the console market, does not innovate anything, if it costs any money (free download/update servers/space and a potential security-risk). If there is any mod that could crash the system, they might find a way to crack the system. I could think that this is sonys motivation behind this.
But still... that is the problem with a closed system like a console.

Yelp!

Not good Sony. Sort it out!

No mods, no EA access, no external drives, no cross play with other consoles. Looks like Sony is trying to wall itself off more and more because the PS4 is selling so well so they don't care.

If any of you have been following this then you'll probably be on the fence about who to believe on this.

Bethesda have not been kind to Sony or Playstation fans. We all remember how broken Oblivion is, how broken Skyrim is, how long it took to get the DLC, and how MS got first dibs on mod support.

That said, there are reasons to take Pete Hines at his word this time, even though normally he's an arrogant mouthpiece.

While both the Xbox and Playstation consoles use proprietary sound formats to curb piracy, it is rumoured that the difference between the two comes into play with file size caps and memory usage.

MS has allowed a mod cap of 2GB whereas Sony only 900mb. MS has allowed more memory access while Sony has restricted it. It seems Sony is unwilling to budge on this.

Sony are to blame, as is Bethesda for giving special treatment and doubtlessly just springing mods on Sony on a whim think "we're Bethesda, give us what we want."

But there's 2 more people/groups to blame. They are Geohot and those like him who took advantage of Sony's good graces with PS3 features by making ways to compromise security, and the fanbots who consistently railed Sony on security even after the PSN hack, spreading FUD that identity theft was happening and that Sony was to blame. Sony listened to the market, and more importantly shareholders, and tightened up their security sphincters as a result. They now have 360 era Microsoft's attitudes towards cross play and security and you can't really blame them.

However, this is a kick in the teeth, and in my own personal opinion, if Sony does not address this, they lose the privilege of claiming they are for the players and have the best place to play. Because, at least as far as mods go, they don't.

I really do think Sony and MS have switched roles this gen. Some things Sony didnt do last gen that MS did... they are doing now. And same with MS in doing things this gen they didnt last.

Besthesda wanted to do mods differently than Sony. Its on Neogaf.

@DragonKnight,

Good read and if I remember correctly Microsoft also had caps for indie game sizes and patches being limited which hurt the game Fez. Ironic how things have now flipped

Bethesda and Sony seemed to always have issues with one another.

Not surprised.

@moldybread: Yep. Last gen MS got flack for those caps big time. This gen it's Sony doing it.

@Harkins: Link?

Anybody else notice Sony becoming a holes the moment Jack Tretton stepped down and Shawn Layden stepped in?

I had a bad feeling about it then. Looks like I was right. Tretton was a gamer, and an all around awesome guy who listened to the consumers. Layden is a suit whose only interest is his own paycheck.

so you don't brick your console, mods are not compatible straight forward

http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

*** they don't want to allow free mods on their platform***

This really does suck, but I don't see where this is mentioned at all. Sony worked with Bethesda and said no finally to whatever it was they were trying to do. We don't know why, and I'd LOVE to hear a response from Sony on this. But, it doesn't mean they didn't want mods on their platform, it could just mean that what they wanted something Bethesda couldn't deliver, meaning they could have asked for more than what was possible at this time. I'm certain part of the problem was due to some limitations on Sony's end, but I don't think they were due to power or technical elements as it relates to software.

"Sony worked with Bethesda and said no finally to whatever it was they were trying to do."

There's been posts on reddit and gaf that actually shed some light on this:

"The beta was cancelled/mods delayed because Bethesda was at a roadblock with Sony refusing to help. The way the post makes it sound is that Sony was ultimately not willing to play ball on this, therefore severely restricting mods and Bethesda didn't want to release mods like that. Would partial support be better than no support? I'd say probably, but that last bit is speculation on my part.

At any rate it's been no secret in the mod author community for months that Sony has been yanking them around about this. Sony assured them it was possible before they announced it, they announced it, then Sony wouldn't make it work. It's very unfortunate for everybody involved but no one more so than PS4 players who are being robbed of something great."

can only assume its some form of security

It actually isn't Sony. Sony stated that every mod had to be vetted by Bethesda and they (Bethesda) have refused to provide the personnel necessary to do this. The insiders are well aware it is Bethesda:

https://abload.de/img/untit...

There isn't one single logical reason why Sony would wish to disallow a feature - mods - that would then make their product - Fallout 4 on PS4 - less attractive. Being thoughtless and saying Sony doesn't know what they are doing isn't a comeback or a counterpoint. People need to stop and employ common sense.

@morganfell: Yeah, a random image with no names is proof. i hope you're not a lawyer.

@Morganfell

A screenshot of some text messages...well.. I'm convinced.

You two should do your homework. You look ridiculous. This image was posted at Neogaf. I don't like that site nor the people that run it but they do have contacts all over the industry. Anyone posting an image such as this and claiming it real is subject to be banned. Bishop - if you know Gaf then you know who he is - reached out to his industry people and verified it is absolutely real from someone working on the inside. If nothing else Gaf doesn't play games when it comes to such posts.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

It doesn't let you blame Sony which is what you really want but instead shows who is actually at fault. Sony is determined not to have the mess that has happened with the Xbox.

EDIT: What is really laughable is Bethesda put out a remark and no one even bothered to question it. They just took it and ran with it. Bethesda, the company that for whom Todd Howard works and possesses one of the most indictable histories of dishonesty with their games. Look at the Xbox. No one is calling Bethesda and saying, "Hey this mod is crashing my Xbox. No, they call and blame MS which is entirely wrong.

@morganfell; You post a random image, with a url that means nothing, filled with text messages with no identifiers in it, and we're the ones that look ridiculous?

Tell you what, I have an igloo on the sun you can buy. It totally has not melted from the extreme solar temperatures, and if you need proof I can show you a totally legit picture.

Consider that all mods to be put on consoles must be uploaded to Bethesda.net. Meaning Bethesda already has quality control set in place. Mod creators HATE Bethesda.net and use Nexus instead. The idea that mods aren't on PS4 because Bethesda won't QA test them is factually erroneous because, again, Bethesda forces all console mods to be uploaded to their network, and not through any other network. This is why you won't see nude mods on consoles for example.

A bit of basic common sense goes a long way, but you'll believe anything that protects Sony no matter what it is.

OH!! An image of a text message from Neogaf!

Well that changes everything...I am double convinced!

Is there anything you can tell me to triple convince me? Maybe a screen shot of a message that says "This is sony and it's not our fault".

Doubling down on your errors only makes the both of you twice as wrong. Instead of stopping to investigate you opt to redouble your efforts to headbut that brick wall. Good luck. Seeing how little you know about the way Gaf functions as regards such mattes disarms you in any such discussion and leaves you squarely in the camp of the uninformed. Most core gamers understand quite well how matters operate at Neogaf and when they certify such an image it is because their solid contacts have found it's veracity beyond reproach. Good luck in your blind, uninformed hate. It will not in the end, serve you well.

@morganfell; "Doubling down on your errors only makes the both of you twice as wrong."

If anyone is doubling down here, it's you, and you're the one looking the fool for doing so.

"Instead of stopping to investigate you opt to redouble your efforts to headbut that brick wall. Good luck."

Your idea of investigation is taking NeoGaf at their word and believing a factless image. Because NeoGaf says something is legit, it is? What kind of evidence is that? Oh, because people who lie will be banned? Right, this coming from a cesspool SJW site that banned Boogie2988 for not marching in anti GamerGate lockstep. Yeah, NeoGaf is SOOO credible. It's not like the industry hates that site... oh wait.

"Seeing how little you know about the way Gaf functions as regards such mattes disarms you in any such discussion and leaves you squarely in the camp of the uninformed."

I also have a car that runs on positive thoughts alone. As long as you think happy thoughts, the car will move. I have a video of that too. It's totally legit because you can't lie on the internet without being banned from the internet.

"Most core gamers understand quite well how matters operate at Neogaf and when they certify such an image it is because their solid contacts have found it's veracity beyond reproach."

Close your thesaurus.com tab for a second and actually use your brain. First of all, you don't speak for anyone but yourself, so don't go dragging anyone else in here looking for support. Secondly, anyone that takes anyone else's word at face value deserves the snake oil they buy. Just because NeoGaf swears to you something is real, doesn't mean that a lie has not just been spoken. My "solid contacts" tell me that it's actually Nintendo's fault. How are you going to prove I don't have said contacts?

"Good luck in your blind, uninformed hate. It will not in the end, serve you well."

Your verbosity actually makes you look pathetic.

@Bansai: "Yea but it's not Bethesda that shut down the project, it's Sony"

That's based only on the statement made by Bethesda. We don't know what really happened. There are two sides to every story.

Sounds to me like Sony wanted SOME control over the mods coming through. I don't completely blame them. There is some history of consoles being hacked via fake game updates (either the Xbox or the 360, don't remember which, could be hacked to run Linux and install pretty much anything this way). So it could be a security precaution. It could also just be Sony trying to prevent people from putting up creepy pervy mods before Sony could review them.

They didn't say Sony refused to allow mods. They said Sony wouldn't allow people to load any sort of mod they wanted. To me it comes off as Bethesda not getting things 100% the way they wanted it, and went home pouting. They've always been a little jerkish towards Sony.

On a related note don't be surprised if some sort of controversy arises on the MS side of things if they are truly giving these mods the same level of openness that Bethesda apparently demanded of Sony. MS may regret this.

What possible reason could Sony have to not include a 4K player in the Pro? Or enable cross-console play, which devs have also been asking for? Now it looks like HDR will only work with Sony tv's via the HLG format too (Look it up!). Sony's 4 the players alright... only Sony fans are the ones getting played and it's Sony who are the players.

This is 4 the Control

That is some straight BS.. Sony is doing it wrong, in this instance. We Need Mod Support!

What Morgenfell is saying sounds very likely to me. Bethesda have always had the worst QA in the industry, so it's not surprising they don't want to do more of it, that seems to be how they normally operate.

The reason is because they don't want to allow unvetted code on the PS4. They want to be sure that software (mods) don't cause harm to users' devices. But Bethesda wants mods to just release without any oversight. In other words, they want to allow mods without doing any extra work, and Sony is saying, "No, you're going to have to make sure these mods don't cause harm."

It makes sense to me on the surface, as a lot of people would use mods without realizing that they can break games by doing it. My son will be especially saddened, as he was looking forward to mods.

Developing mods would technically make you able to find security holes that give you the ability to do all sorts of things with the console. Bethesda probably couldn't guarantee Sony that this won't happen so they had to cancel it. Certainly disappointing, but not quite surprising.

@nX

Papyrus is the scripting language fallout 4 uses and it is literally only used in bethesda games and cannot interact with anything else unless people modify other libraries (impossible on console).

As for the new "proof" - lmao, it's laughable Sony thinks bethesda would have the resources to QA all community made mods, noone does that, Sony wanted a reason to shut this down, so they made an impossible request, typical.

@Goldby, I heard the same reason for not allowing external drive support.

But Im wondering how the Xbox One and Wii U can do and they don't.

@joeorc

Actually what it boils down to is Sony saying no to mods.

@Golby I remember the Wii being hacked through an altered Twilight Princess save. A mod could possibly glitch the system into a vulnerable state especially if that is the intention.

@Ginpachi
Fanboys... and denial. If people would actually put facts or a good answer back would mean that they werent a fanboy. Now they just click disagree because..

As a day-one PlayStation 4 owner and as a lifelong PlayStation consumer I don't know if I could entirely say that Sony is not at fault , you have to understand that PlayStation 4 is still Sony's platform and if a developer is saying there mods can't work because of something very specific, I can't really just disagree with them in that regard as it's slander and it's very clear if it was not true Sony would come out and make a statement.

Does somebody here who works in the game industry who was actually specifically developed on PlayStation 4 know if this is true or not? You would have to consider the statements that this company is making are really huge they're not something slight or small it's a very big company making a huge statement about a console makers platform...

Fallout is all about the Mods.
Broken, glitchy, often pointless but sometimes magical mods.

This is specifically about fallout. They wanted to bring mods to console for a long time, with All the caveats in toe.

Doesn't matter if it makes the game better or worse, its about the freedom to mess around.

Xbox did it, we were then told that sony will to. Now this has happened and gamers have every right to be pissed off.

No excuses, and that is all I can see in your post. Bottom line, we were told it would come to both Xbox and PS, Bethesda and Xbox made it work...

" but the reality is that nobody purchases the game for the mods"

For Bethesda games, many many people purchase these games for mods

It really is as simple as this, they work on Xbox, they don't work on PS4. PS4 is more powerful than the XB1 so why can't Bethesda get them to work? Because Sony won't remove the restrictions they need to

Because nothing's is ever Sony's fault, ever.

So if this is the case, why are there mods for the Xbox One?

The PS4 is more powerful with architecture that is easier for developers to work on and yet Bethesda can't get mods to work on PS4?

@joeorc: While you can probably try to say that, I highly doubt that to be the case here. Look at the language that is used in the update. Bethesda is blaming something specific here, and they put it in pretty clear language that is hard to take out of context: a conflict over who should have curation control. Bethesda wants it to work a certain way (they clearly specify what they want), and Sony is dead set against that. It's not hard to see, knowing how Sony has reacted to any kind of user generated content designed for their platforms that they cannot have complete curative control over. And it's clear of how Bethesda thinks mods should work, since they've been more than supportive to the modding community. It's a conflict of ideals which might not be easily fixed because of deeply rooted the two sides' beliefs to this sort of thing is.

If that's the case then sony should say something, instead of keeping there mouth shut like they always do

I keep seeing people talk about how it's Bethesda fault because they don't like Sony or didn't get along with PS3?

Really, Sony are the ones that came out with a complicated to develop for console.

So much so that the biggest point of ps4 was to make it easiest console to develop for, and if I'm not mistaken if you watch the 2013 ps4 reveal event from February that year I remember Bethesda praising the thing up and down saying it's exactly what they wanted from Sony.

You guys can spin this anyway you want but there is plenty of pissed people that bought fallout 4 because mods were promised and now one console gets them and another doesn't.

It's like the internet doesn't know how to react to Sony being in the negative light.

I do. I also remember the state Far Harbor launched in on PS4.

You mean the same Bugthesda that wouldn't patch their own game of a major glitch? Yeah we should believe Bugthesda.....

http://www.gamespot.com/for...

http://www.ign.com/boards/t...